Sniper Country Duty Roster collective wisdom

Stocks:
( For comments on bedding and stocks also look at Bedding )

Also, I still need some advice on a stock. While I am mainly going to shoot 1000 yard and Palma matches with this rifle, I still want to be able to shoot it across the course. I can't really afford to put mega bucks into a stock, maybe $300 or so. I would like fiberglass with an adjustable cheek and butt.

Steve
Steve <hockyref@bellatlantic>
Greensburg, Pa USA - Thursday, October 22, 1998 at 18:31:30 (EDT) 

Steve: As far as stocks go for around $300.00, check out the UARS stocks. ON the internett go to their homepage at UARS.com. They are about $380.00 but They have a lot of good reports behind them.

al
Al Ostapowicz <aaostapowicz@worldnet.att.net>
Back Home again in my Sweeties' Arms in Lustful, Ohio USA - Thursday, October 22, 1998 at 21:53:04 (EDT) 

I checked out the UARS web sight not sure about that stock, seems alot like the "Ultimate Sniper/Target Stock" from Choate Machine Tools, Inc., which was designed by Major John Plaster. It is half the price. While I kind of like the lines, I am concerned about the lack of weight as I am used to shooting HEAVY rifles in HIPOWER. Also it is obviously an unconventional design. Can anyone tell me more about either of these stocks. I have a few catalogues that say they have MacMillen 40x style stocks with adjustable cheeks supposedly for across the course shooting. They are in the $350.00 range already inletted. Comments? Advice?
Thanks,
Steve
Steve Uhall <hockyref@bellatlantic.net>
Greensburg, Pa USA - Friday, October 23, 1998 at 01:23:37 (EDT) 
Dear Steve: I have also seen the stocks that are made by Choate and if you are comparing the stocks from UARS, that is a big mistake. The stocsk from UARS are machined Aluminum innards and the special composite, (Soft feeling) outer shell. I have seen some the Choate stocks and they look somewhat like a Dragunov sniper stock, made from fiberglass and have a very coarse finish. In this game, you do get what you pay for. I have spoke to Steve Mason about the UARS and have read several articles about it. It has been praised by all who have used it. It does comepletely free float the barrel, however and there are some schools of thought that say for the ultimate accuracy, it should be pillar bedded. I like a free floater. Now the Choate sniper stock is also a free floater, but it looks crude. Choate products are great when it comes to Ruger 10/22 rifles and the like, but when you are talking about the top shelf equipment, on a top shelf barrelled action, topped with a top shelf scope, McMillan, HS Precision and UARS are the stock choices.

I am putting a UARS stock together as a demonstrator for police departments to play with. I give you the feedback as I get it.

Now, I may be wrong about this Choate, maybe I need more convincing about its merits.

al
Al Ostapowicz <aaostapowicz@worldnet.att.net>
South of Canada, but North of Mexico in the Grand Republic of , Ohio USA - Friday, October 23, 1998 at 08:33:17 (EDT) 

Choate Stocks: There are a number of good design features on this stock that are frequently overlooked. My opinion is that it would be a very good stock for a poor mans version of a 50 cal sniper rifle.
In cal. 340 weatherby or so, the weight could be put to good use to help absorb recoil, the whole thing was designed for use with bipod.
the slanted forend is a nice feature for coarse elevation adjustments with a bipod and the butstock is well designed for the off-hand support for bipod prone shooting, the stock was cast around the aluminum bedding block, nothing is going to come loose there. Bottom line is that if you want a special purpose weapon that is going to be deployed in a defensive role or one that is always going to be transported by vehicle, it is not a bad way to go. Lots of guys love their 50 cal McMillan's and you dont see many of them humping their way thru the woods either.

Steve <nato@bright.net>
S.C.D.H., Ohio USA - Friday, October 23, 1998 at 21:47:10 (EDT) 

RE: Richard's Micro-fit Stocks   (  From the Webmaster: This still needs to be added here, and will in due course.  Marius )

While performing recon on this company, I came across a mention of it here back in August and wanted to ask a few questions.to get an idea of what I am buying. The stock will be for a M1 Garand.

1. How much fitting and sanding is needed? I have time to do finish sanding, but not major shaping of the stock. I would prefer a guesstimate in hours for the sanding part, since "not much" or "a lot" isn't very informative.

2. What grade of wood would probably match an issue stock? I don't want to go below issue grade, but buying the AAA Select Super Fancy would look silly on a military gun.

Sarge - your post on the subject was especially helpfull. (now where did he go to .... @%&^ camoflauge)

Thanks and please send me email - I don't lurk around here often.

Karl Dahm <dahm0030@tc.umn.edu>
Minneapolis/St. Paul, MN USA - Saturday, October 31, 1998 at 18:01:03 (EST) 

Re: Richards Microfit Stocks

I'm personally glad Jeff A. is pleased with his stock.

I on the other hand have had a totally dis-satisfied experience with this company.I ordered my Benchmark stock in August and still have not received delivery as of yet.Every time I phone regarding my order I am assured that it will be be shipped out in a few days.

Three weeks ago my Visa statement showed up with a charge for my order.Today I phoned and guess what they told me ?If you guessed,"It will be shipped out in afew days," then move yourself to the head of the class please !

I then told the lady on the other end of the phone that I was told it had been shipped three weeks ago and that it should have been here by now.I asked to talk to someone that knew something regarding my order.

Some guy answered the phone and said,"I think it went out yesterday,".So then told him my story and said this kind of cutomer service was un-acceptable.I said,"Your catalogue says 4-5 weeks for delivery, not 4-5 months,".

I asked for a tracking number so that I could track the delivery progress of my parcel through the post office. He claimed he had none.I asked him to check up on my order and call me back immediately.Well, I'm still waiting for that call.

The only reason I'm telling my long sad story here is to help those of you out there from making the same mistake I did.I'm a big boy and can take my licks so I don't want to seem like a crybaby.

If I could give anybody any advice dealing with mail order business it would be:

(1) Deal only with companies that you can trust and that have a strong reputation for customer service.

(2) Don't give out credit card numbers to companies you've never had done business with before.It goes back to the issue of trust.

(3) Do your business C.O.D. whenever possible.Hey, lets face it, if they ship your goods this way you can bet that they're probably on the up and up.

(4) If you can find an honest company with great customer service,then stick with them even if their product(s) are slightly more in price.

I hope that some of Roster visitors can learn from my mistake,and and save yourself from the kind of situation I am now faced with.

Regards,
Jeff Babineau <2jeff@blaikies.ns.ca>
Truro, N.S. Canada - Friday, November 13, 1998 at 16:14:24 (EST) 

What about the over-sized SM wood stock that the rifle comes with. I really like the feel and weight of the wood but I've been considering a McMillan M1A stock for it's strength and weather-resistance. I'm also thinking about a laminated wood stock for Faejen. I'd like to know if any one has used any or all of these stocks and how they stack up. I'd also like to know the best methods for bedding a synthetic stock.

Any help on a good stock and bedding methods would be GREATLY APPRECIATED.

Brian M. <slapshp7@hotmail.com>
Tustin, CA USA - Monday, November 16, 1998 at 06:24:58 (EST) 

Brian M. I have been waiting close to four months for a Mcmillan A2, you might consider MPI. The tac stock from MPI looks like the McMillan and is less expensive but good quality and they deliver alot quicker. If you want a laminated Fajen, order from Fulton or Brownells fast as they have gone out of business.

Rich <dick2@clarkston.com>
WA USA - Monday, November 16, 1998 at 15:34:03 (EST) 

I got my McMillan stock in 4 weeks, and have all other parts except the barrel.

Bach Melick <tmelick@monbar.com>
New Orleans, LA USA - Monday, November 16, 1998 at 18:47:42 (EST) 

I ordered a McMillan stock on 8/27 and recieved this e mail today: "We just missed your stock on the last run of A-3 stocks and it will be a
couple of more weeks before we get yours out to you. Kelly"
It looks like it's going to be right at four months to get the stock. I'm not writing this to complain as I knew it was going to be a long wait, just to let anyone thinking of ordering know what they are getting into so they don't get pissed when it doesn't show in a few weeks.

Rich <dick2@clarkston.com>
WA USA - Tuesday, November 24, 1998 at 15:19:41 (EST) 

Stocks - Tactical without problems, and with minor work only, go H&S Precision. The stocks take a beating and with minor work ar very accurate and won't change with shots as the "bedded" actions are want to do after several hundred rounds and cleaning cycles. Again, do you want super accuracy or do you want a tactical rifle. The two are not compatible in one rifle. The more accurate the more fragile and that's when Mr. Murphy jumps on your front sight!

Rick <RBowcher@aol.com>
Fayetteville, NC USA - Saturday, December 26, 1998 at 15:53:19 (EST) 

Does anyone have any comments about Brown
Precision? Are their rifles and stocks any
good? More of a hunting gun than a tactical
gun?

Lou S <spunkbubble@juno.com>
S. Fla. USA - Saturday, December 26, 1998 at 20:41:48 (EST) 

Lou,
I have had a lot fo experience with Brown stocks. They are a great hunting stock, since they are abourt one half pound lighter, as for a tactical stock I would be afraid of its abality to take much abuse. I have used them all and for an off the shelf stock you cant beat the H&S. McMillans are good stocks too but you do need to pillar bed them and the Brown stocks or you can start to get some stock crush after a while when torqueing down the action.

Pat <mrbullet@hotmail.com>
USA - Saturday, December 26, 1998 at 21:51:54 (EST) 

McMillian stocks are worth the wait (It is replacing an H.S.Stock). I only asked about pillars because I could see no reason to go with S.S. over Aluminum and thought some of you might have some wisdom.

Mike M. <DMMDNLN@AOL.COM>
Calif. USA - Saturday, December 26, 1998 at 17:11:12 (EST) 

Duuuudes,
The only thing I can say about the laminated stocks is that they have to be bedded just like a fiberglass one. Why take a step back in technology when HS stocks are out there. I know some of you guys just like to play with gooey gloppy shit or with the pillars and bed your own which is cool. Unfortunatley there are guys out there who claim you don't have to bed fiberglass stocks. Billy Martin used to claim that his McMillan made LOD stock was a direct drop in. NOT. WHen you read his ad on the LOD rifle it mentions pillar bedding but I think thats only for the stock on the complete Sako actioned rifle. Buy the stock by itself and you don't get the pillars. I was talking to Bruce Robinson about this and that was how his LOD stock arrived, minus pillars. Decent LE stock but it has to be bedded somehow or like as Mr Bullet says you will crush it and get a bunch of fiberglass dust under the action as the stock material deteriorates. We put a M24 action in it without bedding as per Mr Martins instructions and it shot good. When I took it apart it had glass dust all under it. Not good. Failure waiting to happen.

Why screw with it? With the HS stocks you get a aluminum block which requires no bedding, aluminum through the forestock for the sling swivels to attach to, and no swelling under high humidity conditions (although most properly treated laminates are swell free too).

gooch <kdgooch@aol.com>
USA - Sunday, December 27, 1998 at 12:07:01 (EST) 

Stocks: Isn't that what people put their money in and lose it to somebody called a broker? Really stocks and pillar bedding. There has been a lot of discussion about the pillar bedded rifle and to obtain ultimate accuracy, it should be pillar bedded in some manner. As I stated earlier, I have an article about pillar bedding by Brownell and will recopy it and send it to X-Ring to put in the commentary and article section. Very informative! HS Precision stocks are well worth the money and they can also be ordered from Brownells. They have a complete aluminium receiver area and the torque necessary can be easily applied without damage to the stock. Another stock worth considering the UARS as I mentioned earlier. But McMillian is still the top dog to tactical shooters. Hope this helps.

al
Al Ostapowicz <aaostapowicz@worldnet.att.net>
"Stockin' Up in the Grand Republic of , Ohio USA - Sunday, December 27, 1998 at 18:02:15 (EST) 

Doc,
I think it was you who asked about the DM type, the ones I was talking about were factory, on my new 260 Rem and the others that I had experience with (observed) were on PSSs at a sniper school. In there defense I have a friend who has a 243 with the DM and he has had no problems with his. Mine seems to have trouble with mainly the 1st round after that it will feed ok, most of the time, then again it may not and its really the S..ts when you get a running coyote and you cant feed the next round. (As I am sure Bill will atest to ) I hate something that I cant depend on!!! Once again on stocks, I will probably start a war again, but what the H... !! The URAS and the variants are great for shooting prone or off of a bench but if you have to hump it and carry it on your back all day, over hill and dale, give me a clasic style stock anyday. The PSS style is about as modified as I would want. Then when you get into field shooting and have to shoot in all types of positions once again give me the clasic style stock. Like Sarge, I will duck and wait for incomming fire!!!
Pat <mrbullet@hotmail.com>
USA - Sunday, December 27, 1998 at 21:13:42 (EST) 
On the Stock issue again. Why bed when you can use an aluminum bedding block that doesn't deteriorate over time and requires periodic rebedding. Bad for luck if that time you are called out is the time that the stock goes south!!! AS Gooch said, some of you love that goopy stuff and the challenge of making it right. However, again alittle solvent in the wrong place, a slight imperfection, unnoticed until in a situation, and bang, thrown shot. Unfortunately, I have seen it happen. As the others have said, let the games begin!!

Rick <RBowcher@aol.com>
Fayetteville, NC USA - Sunday, December 27, 1998 at 22:50:45 (EST) 

Rifle Stocks:

The key word in rifle stocks is ERGONOMICS. A rifle stock must fit the shooter or the system will not work to it's full capability.

I have used several stocks over the years, these include the HS-Precision, McMillian A-1, A-2 and A-3, Accuarcy International rifles, Choate Ultimate Sniper, and various wooden stocks. I am currently testing a TechniCarbon Dynamics Stock.

When considering a stock pattern the shooter/ Sniper will have to experiment with the various desgins and find the one that fits them. Remember every shooter is different and what might be ideal for me may not be for the next guy. The problems I encounter with a stock design may not occure to someone else.

The HS Precision stock used on the M-24 is an excellent stock for it's intended purpose. The problem's I have encountered with it stem from the angle of the pistol grip/ small of the stock. The angle is to much for me to comfortably grasp. The bedding block system works. I have seem some of these rifles improve in the repeatibility when properly bedded. (If the rifle needs help to maintain the first shot repeatability then by all means have the rifle bedded.) I would like to see an adjustable cheek piece and do away with the adjustable length of pull mechanisim. Spacers work well when adjusting the length of pull. I just never could feel comfortable wrapping cardboard and duct tape to get a proper cheek weld.

The McMillian A-1 stock suffers from the same problems as the HS stock with the lack of an adjustable cheek piece, and the pistol grip angle. The A-2 and A-3 stocks have a good grip angle and the A-3's adjustable cheek piece is second to none. I prefere the narrower forend of the A-3 as I am a bit old fashioned I still teach the use of a sling along with the use of supported rests. (Still not a real big fan of the Bi-Pod though.) When having one of these stocks bedded insist on having it bedded with Devcon Titanium. This material will last the life of the barrel if bedded properly. What more would one want??

I reciently purchased a TechniCarbon Dynamics stock for testing. The first impression was one of the Accuarcy International stock. While a fine rifle and stock system. The bottom of my trigger hand makes contact with the stock at the bottom of the thumb hole area and is not comfortable. The Accuarcy International rifles are designed to be shot from either shoulder and both hands make the same contact. The TechniCarbon stock does not make as much contact and after it is bedded I will give an honest to goodness thrashing and see what shakes out. The problem of the contact with the stock in the thumb hole area is not just with these two stocks. The Choate Ultimate Sniper stock has trhe same problem. (Maybe my hand is just to big.) The other problem with the Ultimate Sniper Stock is it's angled forend. I have just never had any luck finding a surface where it sits as well as a flat forend.

First shot repeatability is the mandate of the modern sniper rifle. Wood Stocks are for sporting purposes and have no place on a sniper rifle. They are affected by moisture, and heat to much. Besides they will not take the beating a sniper rifle will encounter.

Try as many stock patterns before you spend your hard earned money or your department's money on a new stock. As for bedding the rifle needs bedding have it done by a compitent gunsmith and insist on the Devcon Titanium product. If they don't want to do it go see someone else. Find a real gunsmith who understands the stresses the rifle will be used under and stick with him. There are not may of them.

Bruce G. Buell, NCDS
Senior Instructor, IDRC
Bruce G. Buell <buellncds@mindspring.com>
Jacksonville, FL USA - Monday, December 28, 1998 at 23:12:37 (EST) 

Bruce:

Just read your post re: stocks. Very good. I agree that the A-2 grip config. is a bit more user/wrist friendly (to me,anyway) than the M-24 by HS. The shape of the Richard's Microfit tactical laminant feels identical to the Lonewolf tactical. It has an Anchutz(?)-like look and feel. The grip is close to vertical (moreso than A-2) and is offset to the right to accomodate the right handed shooter. Very nice feel. If I lie prone for any lenght of time at all, the stress to the wrist becomes noticeable somewhat w/ the M-24. Not so w/ A-2 or the Richard's tactical.

On an impulse purchase, I ordered a tecnicarbon dynamics for Rem SA. Walt's great to talk to. Only problem is I've nothing to put in it. So, I'm holding this stock w/ all the extras, and nothing to do with it. Yet. May have to sell it at some point. Anyway, if I ever get to the point (read win the lotto), the next project will be with a M70 classic LA w/ 308 boltface. Probably in a McMillan. Probably in 308 or 260( or maybe 6.5/06) so I can seat vld bullets out and not be limited by mag. size. Whoops, going a little tangential , sorry. I haven't really ever treated any of the rifles roughly, so I don't know how sturdy they are. But, I had them built with strenght and sturdiness in mind. Of course, after each shooting, I clean thoroughly, and wipe them down with a diaper. Go figure.

Jeff A. <d1k2l3@aol.com>
Atlanta, Ga USA - Tuesday, December 29, 1998 at 20:53:10 (EST) 

Stocks glad I stimulated some conversation. I have to agree with who ever said that he has had good luck bedding the H.S. Stocks. I started doing this a few years ago and it has improved the groups on six out of six PSS's so far. I talked with an FBI Instructor that said they are doing it to all there PSS's also. He said they don't buy Winchesters anymore. I have not examined any FBI Rifles yet to conferm this.

Mike M. <DMMDNLN@AOL.COM>
Calif USA - Tuesday, December 29, 1998 at 21:29:38 (EST) 

On ordering an A2 McMillan stock, if you go with the adjustible butt and cheek, have McMillan or your gunsmith anodize the hardware to a matte finish of some type, otherwise you may find yourself painting your new $700 stock. Also a nice feature I like on my A2 is the forearm rail. It allows you a lot of adjustment with a Harris bipod. As far as scopes go, if you can afford them and can stand the wait, US Optics are excellent. I'd stay with a 30mm tube and a 44mm objective though, anything larger is like having a spotting scope mounted to your rifle. I'm currently playing with my new AWC systems M92 in 308w with an SN6 10x on it using Berger 168 VLD molly handloads. I have to get my reading glasses out to determine the group size. Great rifle. Any 30-378 Wby handloaders out there ? Currently using IMr 7828 w/nosler 180 silver tips, get about a 5/8" group. Any other suggestions ? Thanks. De Oppresso Liber.
Tony Y. <anthony.yackowski@citicorp.com>
Iselin, NJ USA - Wednesday, December 30, 1998 at 17:37:56 (EST) 
Choate Sniper stock, comments anyone? Anyone tried to put a Rem 700 SA detachable mag in one? I think it makes the BDL's into a blind magazine ala an ADL. Colors? I have seen green, and black, but have heard of "camo" color, it is multi colors as if they injected multiple colors when making it? Thanks.
Mike S <mws@ecom.net>
Southern, California USA - Friday, January 08, 1999 at 22:19:17 (EST) 
Mike,

I used A Choate sniper stock this past season in Fullbore "F" Class shooting. This type shooting is done from the ground, off bag and bipod, with scope. Not particularly different from serious work or hunting varmints.

Not much to offer on implanting a removable magazine, but I must say I did like the stock for shooting off the ground with a bipod. Off the bench is a different subject!

The stock that I used was 700 ADL. For a drop-in it was excellent.
Accuracy, as far as I was concerned, was equal to anything that I have. I do recall that I had to make a slight mod. to the accessory hanger in order to fix the particular Harris bipod that I was using and immediately tossed the plastic eared (accessory plate) jamb nut that slipped on the common hex head screw that was issued.

The front end of the sniper stock is not as rigid as I would like for serious work. It seems they left a lot of cooling room in that area at the expense of rigidity. The angle of the butt, from pistol grip to buttplate is roughly on the same plane as the barreled action. This is not good if a quick second shot is necessary, especially off the bench. What I'm saying is that far too much "hunting" is necessary for quick target acquisition. Off hard ground, the threaded elevation pedistal on the bottom of the butt is fine, but in soft ground it would be next to useless. Also, the stock is a bit heavy to use for as a carry rifle.

My stock came with two cheekpieces. One or the other should fill the bill. Also, length of pull and buttplate positing is adjustable to the point that about anyone could fit the stock.

All in all, I was quite pleased for the dollar. If you are considering this stock for varmint hunting, I would offer that Choate has a varmint stock that might be a little more pleasing off the bench. Also, a little more rigid and less angled in the front end. My stock, in the off season, is also used for testing barreled actions. It serves very well for this purpose, and offers a barrel channel large enough for anything I see.

I like it!

Bill Wylde <k9wxr@rr1.net>
FROZEN - SE, IL USA - Saturday, January 09, 1999 at 00:17:46 (EST) 

Mr. Ryan,
My question is concerning stocks for tactical bolt rifles. Have you had any experience with the L.O.D. replacement stocks? Would you consider it to be worth the price difference over the UARS stock? My only experience is seeing pictures and the UARS is an ugly duckling to me but my primary consideration is performance. Besides, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Thanks!
Tom B.
Tom B. <tiaraproductions@msn.com>
USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 02:24:19 (ZULU) 
Cory: Check the Feb. issue of TS for my comments on the UARS and some pics of LeMay and Herig. No, they still have their clothes on.

Tom B.: I dont have any experiance with the LOD stocks so I cant say good or bad. I do know that they have to be bedded. The UARS stock is a true drop in on an aluminum rail. Whole thing from start to finish takes about 15 minutes and the groups on the gun we tested on were cut in half. If you dont get TS, send me an e-mail and I will send you a copy of the article.

The gun belongs to Jim LeMay. Jim, you out there? What are your comments on the stock?

Rod Ryan <ryan@stormmountain.com>
Elk Garden, WV, USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 02:41:28 (ZULU) 

On the question about LOD, UARS stocks etc. Both of these stocks are comfortable to shoot. Only problem I have with either of them is the thumbhole configuration. Here is my resoning or lack of therein..

All of the bolt action recievers I deal with have their safeties positioned so they can be manipulated by the thumb with the shooters hand gripping the stock with only minor movement. The old style RUGER safety was the best location as it was out of the way on a stalk, easy to get to etc. A thumbhole stock requires that the shooter totally release the grip to manipulate the trigger on these actions.

Now some school of thoughts say not to use the safety when in firing position to which I say Wrongo! Many times a sniper (LE or Mil) will have to lay in wait for his shot or have to move his position once he has loaded. You need to use the safety (especially with some of the triggers Ive felt). THere are two types of shooters, those that have had accidental discharges and those that will have an accidental discharge. Anyway, I'll stick with a traditionaly configured stock which allows me to manipulate the safety as it was intended. Sure you got to remember to take it off or you look stupid but that is a training issue that can be handled.

gooch <gooch@stormmountain.com>
USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 14:59:33 (ZULU) 

OOOPS. "A thumbhole stock requires that the shooter totally release the grip to manipulate the SAFETY on these actions."

Send him to the rack!!
gooch <gooch@stormmountain.com>
USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 15:03:11 (ZULU) 

Gooch.  Welcome back!! I agree with you on the stock issue esp. when you have to carry them and shoot from all types of positions, a good classic style stock is hard to beat. The H&S stocks I have are bedded and the accuracy did improve, but H&S does not recommend that you bed their stocks, for whatever reason, maybe our H&S guy can tell us why. I find it hard to believe that I could take my rifle out of the H&S stock and shrink the group size by simply putting it in one of those fancy stocks.
Pat <mrbullet@hotmail.com>
USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 15:18:40 (ZULU) 
My 2 cents on the UARS stock. Well if you want to take a $400. Rem 308 VS that shoots 1 1/4 to 3/4 MOA depending on the ammo. And make it shoot 1 to 1/2 MOA or less depending on ammo, with out beding its a stock for you. But their are some disadvantages too with the stock. The safeties you do have to move your hand to use it like on a HK 91. The synthetic cheekpad has to be taked off to get a rod guide in for cleaning. So that means that you need to carry an allen wrench in your cleaning kit. The weight, it is heavier then the other stocks. And that makes a deference if you have to hump it a long ways. And the magazine is the big one. The one I have only holds 3 rounds. 1 in the pipe and two in the magazine. And I see that as the big disadvantage in the one I have. When shooting down at the TPA sniper shoot last Oct. Some of the stages you are under time. And try to gets 5 rounds off in 20 sec. is a hard thing to do and stay on target when reloading by hand. The reason way the stock only holds 3 rounds is that some states only allow you to have 3 rounds in your gun for hunting. Thats what Rusty told me from Autauga Arms. I think that was Cal. and Az. But it does look like that they are comeing up with 5 and 10 round mags for it soon. So that will be a big help for shooting at comps. So if your going to be out at SMTC in June or at the Hathcouk match in Oct I'll let you shoot it if you want. LeMay OUT
LeMay <lemayj@mdot.state.mi.us>
Michigan, USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 19:00:31 (ZULU) 
On impulse, I removed the barreled action from my 308 and dropped it into a stock I got from Walt at Technicarbon Dynamics. I spent about an hour and a half talking to Walt, and decidided to try one of his stocks sight unseen. It seems I remember his telling me that no bedding or anything was necessary.. just drop in and go. This was 2 or 3 months ago. I got the stock and just held onto it until week before last.

Anyway, so I drop in and tighten the two screws that came with the stock. Different allen head size so I just guestimated the torque cause I couldn't use the torque wrench. I have taken it to the range and put approx 130 rds. thru and the accuracy is just as good a it was. No accuracy loss whatsoever that I can detect. I left the scope attached to action when I did this and the only change from the prior setup was one minute of elevation in the scope setting. It appears to be a good fit and the barrel floats from the lug forward. Plus, the shape of the stock is much, much more amenable to good position. Meaning that, when shooting prone, I can hold steadier and with way less tension and therefore shoot better. I thought the accuracy would suffer for sure but it hasn't.

The big struggle that I've been having all along is that I've never really been able to have rifle properly on target AND acheive a settled, stable overall body position. It would be one or the other. Always thought it was me just doing something wrong, which is true, but now, it seems that a change in stock type or design has had something to with it. I'm rattling on a bit here but this was a nice surprise in a couple of ways. Understand that I'm speaking about prone position only at this point and being still a newbie, I've much to learn.

So, gentleman, is there something I need to check or recheck on this " changing stocks in mid-stream "? It looks like a good thing, but I thought I'd throw it out for a look-see.

Jeff A.
Jeff A. <d1k2l3@aol.com>
Smyrna, Ga, USA - Sunday, February 07, 1999 at 14:30:37 (ZULU) 

About stocks for sniper rifles.I noticed no one mentions the stocked sold and designed by Billy Martin of L.O.D.I have ones of these stocks on my Rem. PSS and i like it.It is well made and it works good.I have seen some Mcmillan stocks and some of the adjustable cheek pieces on there stocks do not have the raised area for the cheek piece.When you tighted up the adjusting screw for the cheek piece and after several firing the cheek piece slides back to the bottom.On the L.O.D stock when you adjust the cheek piece it stays in place until you move it.Also the way the sling swivels are mounted on the stock you can put them on the right or left and you carry the rifle flat against your body and it maked it easy to carry.If you want to know more about the stock or how much they cost look up L.O.D.s web site at WWW.LODTRAINING.COM
SFC PETE CARPENTIER JR <PETEC@CIRIS.NET>
C.C., TEXAS, USA - Monday, February 22, 1999 at 03:08:37 (ZULU) 

 
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