February 24, 2001 - February 28, 2001
I have a gen "1" with the 7.62 reticle, and the 40mm ".223", with
the same type of range finding reticle, except for .223.
The bubble levels DON'T BREAK... they are solid, and very useful...
especially if you are one of those who's life is a bit "tilted" ;))
I have bubble levels on all my long-range riffles, and they work.
They are big, and rugged... they are guarenteed to take the recoil
of a 50-BMG rifle, and they do it just fine.
Even one of the long time S.A. scope haters on this site, recently
posted that he has come to like them. They are NOT the optical equal of
a $1200 scope, but they cost 1/3 to 1/2 of that.
The Gen "1" does not have parallex adjustment, the gen "2", and gen
"3" do have it, though I don't think it's all that necessary.
If you shoot the 168SMK at 2650, then you can use the "7.62" rangefinding
reticle... it's a bit cluttered, but the fastest scope in the business
for a spotters rifle.
If you are shooting enyother caliber, then get the mil-dot, and
a "Mildot Master", and you're good to go.
The POI does not change, for any practical purpose (maybe a 1/20" at 100 yds)
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
"Dickhead army guys!!!" Now, even the rick-ster don't get no respect
:(( in the muddy, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 00:59:31 (ZULU)
(your host address: 208.249.180.111)
http://www.petitiononline.com/75thrgr/petition.html
Sharky <landshark375@yahoo.com>
El Paso, TX, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 01:38:46 (ZULU) (your
host address: 24.162.205.13)
I have just purchased a pre-ban AR and I want to put a collapsible
stock on it.
I have heard some stocks are prone to break during a stuck round
extraction when the T handle I held by the right hand and the butt stock
is struck against the ground.
.
Any comments on which ones to buy or stay away from
Does anyone make a 100% steel stock?
Thanks,
mike <mikewood_@excite.com>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 02:06:27 (ZULU) (your host address:
216.118.9.20)
To mirror Mictac, swore to the oath as an LEO for both the federal and state constitution two times (two departments) and carry a copy of the federal constitution in my pocket (a neat, pocket sized book published by The CATO Institute).
Swore to it for my military duty and appreciate it even more now than when I was 19 going in.
Wish more folks would respect and honor it as well.
All:
Need input from your end (LEO and others) regarding duty loads in .223 for your patrol rifles. We are finally green lighted for rifles (long story why it took so long). While I am getting info from local agencies who have put them into service, I'd like to hear from all regarding what you are using. For the experienced non-LE types, please play the "what if" game as in, if you were the administrator making the decision, what would you recommend for a duty load. You input is valued.
Thanks in advance for your input. I'd like to take your responses by e-mail if possible to keep bandwidth low.
Morris
Morris <mparrish@oz.net>
Seattle Metro, WA, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 02:30:30 (ZULU)
(your host address: 209.74.212.66)
Richie-You don't know the real differences between the Army and USMC snipers at all. The biggest are they use different mildot reticles in their scopes, the Marines have better issued boots, the Army guys still have a fading memory of eating with utensils (because they are true gentlemen) and the Marines grunt more while doing simple tasks. Everybody knows that the best of the best in the sniper world is the LEO sniper...(this will ruffle some feathers but it's all in fun)
Now all joking around aside. The true professional sniper, regardless of branch of service or LE agency is not there to kill anyone that they don't have too. This a dedicated, highly trained small group of people who have one goal....To serve and to serve well. The Consitution and law are paramount to them and they have made a decision to use a talent/gift given to them for a betterment of our country and society.
Richie-you do not have these gifts seek another profession when you grow up. Unless you make a 180 degree turn around the military (USMC or Army) will have no use for you. Spend more time listening to your teachers and learn to write and spell better it will be for your own good.
Simply said-Go away kid you bother me.
joe <spojoehpd@aol.com>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 02:47:19 (ZULU) (your host address:
64.12.105.153)
Jason B
Before you go changing your trigger out, make sure you know what you plan on using the gun for. Since you mention getting a "precision" trigger, I assume you want to get into high power service rifle or benchrest shooting.
In which case you might seriously consider the Jewell two stage trigger. The second stage can be tuned to let off at a couple of ounces. Kinda pricey at $200.
If your using the gun in a tactical role, you don't want no hair trigger setup! You didn't mention what flavor you have. I have a Colt R6551 and switched out the standard trigger for Colt's "match trigger" setup. It ain't no Jewell or JP but it does break at 4.5 pounds which works well with extra dumps of adreneline!
Moe
Moe Mensale <mjmensale@aol.com>
Boca Raton, FL, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 03:25:41 (ZULU)
(your host address: 152.163.205.32)
Youse guys must be really bored and/or not getting enough trigger time! I don't believe how much bandwidth we've wasted on this illiterate little snot who doesn't respect his mother! LOL
Moe
Moe Mensale <mjmensale@aol.com>
Richieville, USA, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 03:36:13 (ZULU)
(your host address: 152.163.205.32)
Bill You a hoot man, two toned yotes! Now that would be a real fun video for PETA.
Just finished up with a class that 7th SFG put together. Not bad graduated 16 of 24 students, even had a good smart guy that is with the 7th that had the good sense to change from Marine to SF sniper instructor. :-)
Rick
Rick <rbowcher@aol.com>
Fayetteville, NC, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 03:38:09 (ZULU)
(your host address: 205.188.193.48)
Mike Miller,
I still catch ya on your late nite info-mercials during my insomniatic fits, heheh. It's good to see the face of the guy you've barreled for. Glad to hear the Lapua is treating you well, seems to be a popular cartridge nowadays.
'lito:
As a barrelmaker, I believe that everyone should shoot the 220 swifts, 257 wby, 6.5 x 284, 264 win mag, and all the other hot rod Lazzeroni 30 cals you can find. Keep me busy boys!!!
Dead on as usual as far as the barrel wear info..... The Win Mag was the perfect example of wear as relative to bore diameter to propellant capacity. Include throat dimensions though, because remember that a 'shot out' barrel is one that is shot out past the leade (throat) where the lands are worn to the groove and gases are escaping ahead of the bullet inhibiting velocity and and also bullet upset is occuring due to the 'jump' to the minor diameter of the thread (land). Actual bore diameter will be a factor. I would always suggest that you rebarrel with a groove diameter at or just under the bullet diameter, but the bore diameter (diameter of the lands) is something I'm struggling with. Will a barrel with .300 bore shoot longer than one with a .301 bore?? I believe so. With a .308 groove diameter you have .004" land with the .300" bore, and I have seen 308's with bore diameters up to .302" which would only give you .003" of land to wear, so I do believe different barrels give different results. I do think the light skinned varmint bullets are all right with the shallower bores, but the match and solid bullets like somewhat deeper bores (not grooves, just bores).
Just my grain of salt
JR <jr_rcsd@hotmail.com>
rapid city, sd, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 07:19:40 (ZULU)
(your host address: 208.34.14.23)
Time to go talk to the coyotes.
Ut Fiat Libertas
Samal
Samal <Knife_1@hotmail.com>
Pinchatooly, PA, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 07:24:13 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.91.146.38)
Thanks for the plug. Get those photos back to me and I will send you another of me and the longhorn (no sheep).
Bill Moore,
Drop the ghillie. Hunt the edges, 5 to 6 feet back into the cover. Get an exclusive on the property so's you don't have to contend with other hunters. Contact me offline for further details. Wish I was hunting chucks back east.
Markwell,
PD hunting sucks, from my perspective. Chucks are 200 times smarter. Hiking is the only way to go. Sometimes it results in only taking your rifle for a walk, but I got to watch an albino doe for a half-hour on such a walk. No better way to spend an afternoon. Plus, you might get lucky. Ask 'lito how I feel about chuck hunting.
No need to apologize for being behind my slow-movin' ass.......I'd have been pissed too. Look forward to seeing you again.
Best Regards,
Bruce N. Robinson <bnrobins@flash.net>
Los Lunas, NM, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 07:25:26 (ZULU)
(your host address: 209.254.238.117)
Ritchie, you need to work on your writing skills my friend.
If you really look up to the Marines, be advised that they require
things like attention to detail, respect, and discipline.
Have you talked to a recruiter?
Perhaps you can find one that is willing to give you an idea of
what you will need to accomplish and help you get started. Your mom really
should know what you want to do too, sho may be able to help.
BTW Ritchie, if you can't respect a simple rule about staying off this site, the Marines will have you for lunch and ship you home whining like a whipped pup.
I wish I could do more for you Ritchie but you got some good advice from some of these people (not counting those that slammed you)and you should pay attention to it.
Rex
1911 sight installation. Check out 1911forum.com. All the links
you could ever need, and you will find a good 'smith in short order.
Absolutely get your slide milled and a dovetail front sight put
on. It will never leave you! I am fixin to send my Kimber for adjustable
night sights and a Bar-Sto. Oooooh yeah!! Haven't decided where yet either.
At least I don't have to decide until I have the cash!!
Joe:
"the 666 is a little more difficult to explain because i am in a
band that believes that the 66,600,000 angels that went to hell with lucifer
During the Great divide will return to the heavens one by one, the last
to leave Satan's side being Baal.) anyway......"
What the hell does being in a band have to do with Satan? I am in a band too....www.katella.net. The baddest things I get involved in are drinking beer/liquor and ogling girls, and the reason I play is for the music....M.U.S.I.C. Well, and the girls. Not Satan (or any of his multitudes). People like you give rock n'roll a bad name. Do you put as much time into your playing and writing as you do your fairy tales? Let's take the 666 out of rock ok? Believe whatever you want, but what does Satan (or "Baal") have to do with being in a band? Geez.
Sorry man, pet peeve. Been a Christian AND a musician for 15 years. Too many artists out there and not enough music. And now I suppose the liberals will wanna slam me for being a "Satan hater". And all this coming from someone who's nickname is "Kill"........although some call me "the Nuge" after the famous Motor City Madman.
As far as paintball markers go, if you know about sight alignment, breathing, and trigger control, you are already more accurate than your paint marker. You need to go find an infantry/CQB tactics site. Sniper tactics aren't real relevant to paintball considering the ranges involved. What, are you going to stalk across an open field in full Ghillie to within 25 yds. for that elusive head shot in daylight?
To all:
First time, shot a full auto XM177 I think it was...early 70' vintage,
tele stock 11.5" barrel in .223. All legal class III of course. Make mine
a
semi thank you. You LE guys begging for full auto are just putting yourselves
and others at risk unless you can afford to shoot 500+ rounds a month.
Have a good time getting killed by the BG while you let a full mag loose
over their head under that adrenaline surge.
I had the best luck hitting by shooting fast 3 shot bursts using
trigger discipline, even though the 3rd shot had climbed up to the upper
chest/shoulder area. Anything more than 3 rounds was just a waste of ammo.
It was not even that fun, since when I have gun in hand, the mission is
to hit what you aim at. After the SS109 ran out, we switched to South African
commercial 55grn. Gun short stroked every time. My buddy, who owns the
weapon, blamed it on the grease in the gun (it was cold out, about 5* F)
I think it was the weaker ammo/short barrel.
Who is right?
Too many odd planets in line in the last 24 hours!
Headin' back to the lurkers area.....
Geoff M <kill@internetwis.com>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 08:14:40 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.207.52.51)
Just found this whilst I was catching up on the local news down under:
The New Zealand Police have withdrawn all the rifles used by front-line staff because of an apparant fault in the triggers.
Our rifles are the standard Remington Model Seven .223 with the wood stock and iron sights on the 18.5in barrel.
Could this be related to the recent fuss about the triggers on the Rem 700s?
www.stuff.co.nz/inl/index/0,1008,666772a10,FF.html
I own two Mod 7s and five 700s and have never had a problem with any triggers on them.
We don't carry firearms during general duties, they are all carried in the Sergeant's car with the vests and issued when required.
Sometimes it is comforting to have more than an ASP baton, OC spray and your communication skills to deal with a situation.
I wont even bother to ask if I can take my TBA M40A1 to work "just in case". ;-)
Sniff
Auckland, New Zealand
Sniff <akh805@actrix.gen.nz>
Auckland, New Zealand - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 09:41:06 (ZULU)
(your host address: 202.154.128.189)
On Brownells's stainles steel bedding compound.. it's all I use now!
I used it on the M24 I built last summer, and fell in love (almost as fast
as I did with Torstens friend!).
Zero shrinkage, and "tough as steel". It also mixes up as a thick
puddy, so it doesn't flow all over the place, where you don't want it to
go.
Also, I used to use "Pam" or whatever I had around, as a release
agent... Don't!
I have switched to the Brownell's spray-on release agent, and it's
very much more betterer.... but this has nothing to do with steel bed...
just a better release agent.
Remember to use clay to fill all indentations, or you will have
a very bad day... but that applies to ALL glass bedding goop!
Bruce...
The photos will go out on Monday, or Tuesday, by Express Mail...
INSURED for $250,000 ;))
PD's are dumber than guppies, but are good shooting if you give them
some distance... I worked the towns around Senic, South Dakota, some time
back, and it was good... you can take shots that are amazing in distance...
and they die easily... a .223, or .222 Mag will be all you need. they "Pop"
like water balloons.
But it's strictly shooting, not "hunting"...it takes no skill to
sneak up on them... the Injuns can sneak up and bop 'em with a stick (but
the white eyes can get within 200 yds ;).
I think that chucks take more "killin" per pound, than any other critter I know of... they are 15 pounds of fuzzy Arnold Schwartznegger.
I was talkin' to Ken Hunter (who hosts SniperCountry) by phone the
other night, and all this talk about chucks and crows, has him in a fever...
he's lookin' for a .223 Winchester M70 Stealth... he's a lost puppy now,
and Mrs Kim is a "Chuck widow" ;)))
You guys down in VA, and W.VA... get in touch with Ken, and take
him out to roll a few chucks.
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 10:13:21 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.22)
With the promise of Spring the talk around the house is now focused on Woodchuck hunting. It is nice to read that so many others enjoy this passtime as well.
Hunting these critters is good fun and great training. The satisfaction that comes from tipping over a Chuck at a good distance is hard to beat.
When I was down at Badlands TC last spring Bobby and I were talking about PDs and Woodchucks. I told him that a late summer Chuck around here could run 15 to 20 pounds. He was polite enough not to say what he was thinking. I'm considering packing one in dry ice and sending it down to OK as proof.
Got a picture here somewhere of Andy with a "yard-wide" grin holding up his first Chuck. He has long since driven the local Chuck population to the brink of extinction. It just ain't safe for 'em 'round here no more.
Our Chuck Prescription: .223/45 gr. JHP/3,600 fps
Kevin R. Mussack (Andy's Dad) <kmussack@aol.com>
Clifton Springs, New York, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 13:00:59
(ZULU) (your host address: 64.12.102.184)
I recently had one installed in an AR-15, and today was checking it out a bit. It's a 2 stage trigger and can be adjusted for very light trigger pull if that's your thing. First off, upon examining the trigger and its various parts I noticed the surfaces were quite rough. After installation of the trigger the roughness of the surfaces could be felt by a 'notchiness'. You could feel a rough drag when pulling through the take up. When the trigger-pull was adjusted to its lightest setting the rough surfaces of the mechanism would prevent the trigger from returning to original position (pre-take-up). On heavier settings, which resulted in significantly heavier take-up, this wasn't a problem. I think this may wear in, but I'm going to try to have the surfaces polished. Another thing that I felt was just the tiniest bit of creep in the trigger on the 2nd stage. Looking closely at the innards of the trigger mechanism while testing the trigger showed the cause of the creep. The part of the trigger that pushes the hammer off the engagement was torqueing to the left slightly. This part is just following the path of least resistance and in the AR setup the sideways movement isn't prevented by any housing like the Rem 700 version. If you look under magnification you'd probably also find that the surfaces involved in the pushing of the hammer off engagement are PERFECTLY square. A bit of examining witness marks and a super fine polishing stone (plus lots of careful effort) would probably solve this.
Not much to say about the JP. Had one on this very same AR before the Jewell was installed. It's a single stage trigger. At the time I had it installed I was even less experienced with rifles so I didn't have too much done in terms of lightening the pull etc. Basically, the reason for the switch was the other half thought it was breaking 'notchy' and she likes 2 stage triggers. I bet the same polishing would make this a great trigger, but not much could be done about it being a 1 stage so ... Since the hostile takeover of my 'evil black gun' (better her than the gov.) I indulged her this =).
I'll give an update after I get to try the trigger again!
Rex
Rex <izrafil@pacbell.net>
Bay Area, 'Sunny' CA, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 13:02:37
(ZULU) (your host address: 63.198.191.2)
P.S. anyone fimilar with Leupold LPS series scopes?
CVDRIVER <BROWNSILVA@AOL.COM>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 14:26:45 (ZULU) (your host address:
64.12.104.34)
Josh Liskowacki <Lisko@.aol>
Upper Black Eddy, Pennsylvania, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at
14:55:33 (ZULU) (your host address: 209.92.174.25)
First off... if you haven't graduated high school, you are TOO YOUNG to be on this site... or you have been left back in class so often that the military won't take you.
Second... consider this. It's not like the movies, and when you get
out, what are you going to do for a living? The FBI won't take you, the
Police won't take you... Unless you have the ability to teach others (a
RARE SKILL), you'll wind up making french fries at burger king.
Get smart, and use your military training for something useful...
get some computer training, and a speciality that is marketable in the
real world.
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 15:16:39 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.68)
I also used to shoot the Conata Basin/Buffalo gap country...went
through there last year on way back from Wy. Lots of dogs you can't shoot
because, as I'm sure you know, it's ferret country now..From what I saw
of the dog population, we should all hope for a quick population explosion
of black footed ferrets so the powers that be will open that country up
again....The shooting would be extrordinary!! Am heading out that way{West]
again in late may/early June on a dog safari and looking for new areas.
Contact me off line if you'd be willing to share some info.[if no, I understand]..I
scoped out ND last year and found some shooting with a bit of leg work..Was
nice to see some new country also..
Rex..Get some Novak lo-mounts with tritium dots..you wont be sorry..
Kevin R.M....Brink of extinction??? Andy needs to be sure to leave some chucks for seed....I never shoot any 'til late June/ early July to make sure the little one s are out on there own[more targets also] and usually don't shoot any after early Sept..Have been shooting one farm in particular every year since I've lived here[ about 30 yrs.] and every year there are plenty of chucks to go around....Back when I was really into it, 100+ a year was pretty normal for a summer, but had to travel around the country side to get that many...Place where I lived in the '70s thru early '80s I could shoot 'em off the back steps looking up a big valley pasture behind the house...
Chuck medicine....223/55gr. ballistic tip @ 3100
22-250/same but faster.
Ken Hunter...A bit of chuck shooting could probably be arranged.....
outa here
Markwell <markwell@hardynet.com>
Time to load MORE varmint ammo in the Alleghenies, WV, USA - Saturday,
February 24, 2001 at 16:05:01 (ZULU) (your host address: 63.92.148.221)
Call up Hornady and ask for some samples of their 55 and 60 grain
TAP ammo. Also ask for a copy of their testing protocol and results. They
will happily send you both.
When you talk to the brass be sure to point out the penetration issues
of the TAP (or lack thereof) as a safety factor. I went with the 55 grain
to closely mirror the 55 grain FMJ rounds we use for practice and for penetration.
If you use the 62 grain for training-go with the 60 grain TAP for a close
ballistic match.
Hope this helps- (and if it does you owe me a Bravo brew!)
Mike T
Mike T <getting rid
of aol@aol.com>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 16:05:47 (ZULU) (your host address:
65.11.197.193)
And, what ever became of children beeing seen and not heard? This
place is turning into a day-care center.
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 16:09:04 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
"Mamma Mamma I don't wanna be a Marine!"
"Shut up kid and stick you head in this jar!!"
O.K. Seriously now. The Marines are experts at what they do and deserve
our every respect. I mean, come on- when was the last time one of our ships
was stolen! (INCOMING...!)
Bill Moore <lmalterna@aol.com>
Goodview, VA, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 16:31:01 (ZULU)
(your host address: 152.163.201.47)
"I'm a little tea pot short and........." You know the drill.
">I want to be a sniper in the marines after I graduate High School.
I think That I can make a very good sniper after many training sessions.<"
Try it you'll see.
Or is it the "little engine that could."......"I think I can, I think I can........."
Hmmmmm...Oh well.
On a real type note.....anyone know of an organized (or not) shoot
in upstate NY?
Mark <beowulf4_hire@hotmail.com>
Small City, NY, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 17:25:24 (ZULU)
(your host address: 147.205.112.19)
LOL-Just kidding Andy and your Dad!
MikeT
Mike T <mictac@aol.com>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 17:49:08 (ZULU) (your host address:
65.11.197.193)
Lito:
I understand that you do not like me, and I understand that you
do not want me here. I respect that and you will not hear much from or
about me for a long time. If you ever want to talk, I am sure you know
me e-mail address by now. Otherwise, consider me "shunned".
Geoff:
do not worry about my band...
The 666 thing is an admitidly stupid suffix to my otherwise harmless
e-mail address, and my band sings nothing about satan (avidxxx was my other
e-mail address, but that just did not go over well at all). Both my Grandfathers
were ministers at some points in their lives, and imagine how I felt giving
my e-mail address to my Papa (I still do not think he forgives me!). We
are a metal/progressive group and our songs are pretty fantastical (If
anyone wants the lyrics to either "Box" or "long-Stemmed Rose", e-mail
me). As for music's rep, music does not have a bad name. Look at the stylistic
complexity of the works of Beethoven or Bach and compare it to ANY music
today. I do not think any music today (other than Yanni) will be looked
at as beautiful like the classics are in a hundred years. It is music like
that that keeps "Music" as a term beautiful. And I am not trying to crap
on your or my band by saying that, I am sure you guys are very talented.
Things change, People's tastes grow, and I hate Marylin Manson and Emenem.
Now lets stop talking about music before we anger 'Lito. :P
Bolt & Geoff:
Damn strait I have a turbococker with a "14 barrel and a PMI expansion
chamber with a folding a "T" stock and 9volt hopper and an auto trigger
that drops 13 balls a second that can paint you four colors before you
can say "whats a hopper?" so you had better believe I am looking for that
daytime head shot from a lengthy range of 25 meters. Guerrilla tactics
by night, crazed weasel hunting by day.
CDC:
How's that for punctuation? I'm working on the short and to the
point bit... sorry all :)
and finally...
Richie:
Man, I hate so stand and point at the one person who is less fortunate
than me, but dammit boy, try a kids game like paintball first. When you
get shot out in the first minute of combat and realize that in real life
you would be dead without even getting to shoot your gun, try coming back
here and you will have new respect for these guys (the combat experienced
ones, at least). There are no "dickheads" or whatever. Just the guys keeping
you safe. Just don't shoot your eyes out. You will need them for later.
Joe <avid666@yahoo.com>
HCerry Hill, NJ, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 18:27:54 (ZULU)
(your host address: 151.204.35.156)
700 floorplates: Someone told me that McMillan made one, but I'm damned if I can find it. All I'm finding is the trigger-guard. The Badger is $300. The .300 WM Sendero only cost me $550, so that seems excessive. So, what's the best deal on a Plain-Jane steel floorplate?
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 20:39:07 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
Rex
Rex <rextra@caprock-spur.com>
Spur, Texas, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 21:29:53 (ZULU) (your
host address: 216.167.146.133)
thanks and outa here
markwell <markwell@hardyney.com>
You ought to see the x-ray of the screw in the Alleghenies, WV, USA
- Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 22:14:54 (ZULU) (your host address: 63.92.148.20)
CDC, reminded me of something I have been meaning to share, ( male bonding, don't you just Love it!).
For those of you who are / have been looking for a one piece steel trigger guard for 700 Short actions........that is quality A # 1....and at a reasonable price...look no further.
Mr. John Baier, of Tactical Stocks has manufactured a work of art.
It is bar none, the best looking, and clean steel TG I have ever
seen....
It resembles a Win 70, in the latch dept, but is much harder to
release, which is a GOOD thing.
All moving parts, one, fit like a swiss watch.
It is all steel, and is almost a drop in for a standard Rem....
Exception on the front screw mount, it's tad wider than a std Rem.
All other dims are the same.
Best part, $ 140.00 + shipping.......less than 1/2 of other solid steel TG assy's......
As I stated, the one I recieved was his first, and it was almost too purty to even install............
John also sells McMillan stocks..if you don't want to wait, call him, he MAY have what you are looking for.
The transactions, and dealings I have had with john, are to date A+.......I heartily reccomend him......Mr. George Gardner reccommended him............
I am glad he did........
Two Shoes
Terry <tls8323@cs.com>
USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 22:35:03 (ZULU) (your host address:
152.163.213.73)
http://www.mcmfamily.com/mfsinc_n/retail_pricelist.html
Just keep scrolling down 'till you see it.
Regards,
ALAN <asimon@gj.net>
PALISADE, COLORADO, USA - Saturday, February 24, 2001 at 23:52:16 (ZULU)
(your host address: 216.169.65.10)
Whats up with the kiddie litter that keeps blowin in the door?!
Hey "Slim" I e-mailed ya some real helpful stuff. Run it past your Mom and Dad see if they can tune you up a bit and then come back let us know if there was any pearls of wisdom from them.
Shouldn't these guys be spending their youth trying to get laid rather than collecting tactical training tips?
Seems like a long time since I was a kid but thats what my priorities were. "This is my rifle this is my gun. One is for fighting and one is for fun."
Hey kid have fun; use your gun!
Semper Primus!
Mark <beowulf4_hire@hotmail.com>
Worried about the pediatric content on this site, and my congress woman
in NY, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 02:37:18 (ZULU) (your host address:
147.205.112.19)
Will all the little kiddies that have arrived here this past week, and who want to grow up to be steelie eyed killers... please GROW UP, go away, and talk to your local military recruter.
Tell them you want to learn to kill, maim, and terrify people...
and what should you "try" to learn in grammer school, so you can join up
when you gradjumate... they will tell you what to do (I promise!!)... this
is not a recruting site for snipers!!!
That includes paintball whiners... go whine somewhere else.
---------------------------------------
Badger bases...
You'z guys that are getting Badger bases for the first time... REMEMBER...
that Martin's screws are all the same length (Lupita has two short ones
and two long ones!), which means that at least one will be TOO LONG for
the front screw hole over the barrel thread!!! Also, one may be too long
for the second front screw, blocking the bolt lug from turning!!
When you mount the Badger base... put the front screw in FIRST...
and then cut or grind it down, until it will go all the way in, and snug
the base down, without bottoming in the hole... then try the second, and
make sure the bolt will opperate... then put in the other two screws, otherwise
you will suffer the dreaded "Front screw syndrome"... and you will get
to know your local gunsmith a little better!
:((
Markwell...
"Just how does BRUCE feel about chuck hunting?"...
Bruce sent me the most outstanding pictures of a chuck skull, I've
ever seen.
It was rolled over, up by Kevin and Andy's area.
Normaly chuck's teeth wear against each other as they grow in, so
they are about 3/4 of an inch in an adult... Bruce shot an old grizzled
chuck who's teath had been mis-aligned, and so they didn't wear out, they
kept growing and curved around (and around, and around!!!)... if they were
straightened out, they would be 5 to 7 inches long... they look like curled
mastodon tusks.
I tried to buy the skull, but that booger won't sell it ;))
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 03:24:26 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.90)
Marius - let me know if you want to put those into the photo gallery.
Just click on the link at my post..
Ken :)
Ken
Hunter <Rogue308@Riflemen.net>
Muddy Northern, Va, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 03:29:04 (ZULU)
(your host address: 207.233.164.10)
I'm hoping to get to do some crow shooting over the next couple months but I have to wait for a invitation to come from a friendly farmer or rancher first, that's where all the good shooting is at. Same goes for the really good squirrel shooting, private property is where all the action is at.
Man, parrie dogs and chucks, I can only imagine what that is like. One of these days I'll grab up a case of 55grn Vmax for the 223Rem and I'll head out that way for a varminting mecca.
Lito, I'm really liking the way you sum up the intellegence and physical characteristics of all the varying types of vermin.
Was it also you who warned me that there might be a few Varmint Cong
sympathizers on the board? PETA types perhaps?
B. Douglas <uglygun@lightspeed.net>
Gotta go look for my alternate persona, Bill Murray in CaddyShack,
Ca, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 03:41:11 (ZULU) (your host address:
24.161.204.203)
T. Metcalfe <delta7@gpcom.net>
Tryon, Nebraska, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 04:26:25 (ZULU)
(your host address: 216.170.51.120)
Have been thinking of buying a Remington 700 VSS or variant and cannot for the life of me find a dealer that has any in stock. Is Remington not producing or...?
This keeps up I'll have to find an action and build one!
Semper Fi,
Wes
Wes Howe <wsaa@proaxis.com>
Blodgett, OR, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 05:08:47 (ZULU) (your
host address: 198.145.248.135)
Any comments on what is the best 7.62 Nato/308 rifle to put together whether it be a rem 700 vs, a Win 70 stealth, or some kind of custom job or what.
Also is there a site for Remington LE products?
Is there any good reasons to keep a Browning B.A.R 7mm rem mag, When it is a 82 model (I looked it up with the serial #)and when shooting the other day the pin came loose and the trigger went dead. I think my SMK 168 63 grain imr 4831 loads were slamming the action to badly.
And, Yall quit humoring that snotnose Ritchie if you ignore him he
will quit posting, he gives us civies that want good info on training a
bad name!
Big Will <http://www.Madlogger@hotmail.com>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 05:18:22 (ZULU) (your host address:
166.82.1.83)
Patrick
Pakrat <psfamily@mail.com>
Hempstead, TX, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 05:33:56 (ZULU) (your
host address: 168.69.134.183)
Just perusing my CZ catalogs and noticed that CZ makes a heavy barrel "varmint" rifle in .308. Hmmm. Looks darn good. Anybody have any experience with this rifle. Uses a modified M98 action and adjustable trigger. Dealer price under $500.00.
Just what I need, another .308. I get another and wife will have me back in that 12 step program for .308 users...
Wes
Wes Howe <wsaa@proaxis.com>
Blodgett, OR, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 05:57:39 (ZULU) (your
host address: 198.145.248.135)
I have a bushmaster A3 on the way. What is an appropriate break in for it, I have nerver owned a chrome lined barrel. All comments are apreciated.
Also former Snipers and active Scout/Snipers, What are/were the hardest
things for you to cope with and to learn in the beggining? Whether it be
judging distances, Observation, Sketching/plotting, or just plain old Stalking
ect.? TY for you comments in advance.
Big Will <http://www.Madlogger@hotmail.com>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 06:08:36 (ZULU) (your host address:
166.82.1.83)
When you asked if I would part with that skull, I responded, "Absolutely."
You were just too tight-fisted to pony up the paltry $250 thousand asking price.
Probably had something to do with your squandering your funds on
.50 cal. toys.
Bruce N. Robinson <bnrobins@flash.net>
Los Lunas (no groudhogs), NM, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 07:17:11
(ZULU) (your host address: 209.254.242.207)
Pakrat
Pakrat <psfamily@mail.com>
Hempstead, Tx, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 10:51:52 (ZULU) (your
host address: 168.69.134.183)
On the 98 actions, there are two types... a large ring and a small ring, refering to the size of the front diameter of the action... they do NOT take the same size barrel thread.
Measure the OD of the threaded barrel you have... if it's 0.980", it's for a small ring action... if it measures 1.10", it's for a large ring action... when you know that, then look for a nice action to finish it up.
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 11:47:32 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.101)
Before I use this site's classified, I need to know how one completes a transaction of this type. Obviously, neither the seller nor the buyer wants to get ripped off.
THE SELLER will want to get paid and eliminate any risks to his
or his family's safety.
THE BUYER will want to verify the seller's claims about the
weapon before shelling out the cash.
So how is it done? I don't want to use the local newspaper classifieds because of all the crazies they rustle up. I don't want to drag it to a gun show because this type of transaction would likely involve meeting the "interested" party a second time to close the deal and then there would be AT LEAST one person out there knowing that either:
1. I am walking around with a $3000.00 rifle
2. I am returning to my car with $3000.00 cash
Safely selling this piece is my main concern. Feel free to email me at ( grasscrawler@hotmail.com ). I'm interested in hearing from people who have successfully (AND UNsuccessfully) completed such transactions. What are some of the warning signs besides the obvious?
Thanks for any ideas, advice, or suggestions.
Steve
Steve <grasscrawler@hotmail.com>
Somewhere, Kentucky, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 13:07:19 (ZULU)
(your host address: 204.255.230.15)
You clearly don't have much trust in your fellow man, nor believe
that
your fellow man has any trust in you... and that's OK... each to
his own.
Take your riffle to a gun dealer, and have him sell it for you on consignment, it will cost you 15%, and that 15% will be the price of your peace of mind.
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
The weather is gettin' warmer, the wind is comin' from the south, and
I can smell "Varmint Poontang", in the gettin' mo' betterer, USA - Sunday,
February 25, 2001 at 13:49:49 (ZULU) (your host address: 208.249.180.70)
I'm glad to hear from you, I think I'm going through "Bolt" & "Trigger', withdrawals!!!......
Cold sweats, and shaking right index finger....you know the drill....
However..been fastidiously at the Bench.............mucho roundos.
Color me ready and more than willing..will be down soon...
Hope you are well, and tell Ms.A, and Mr.B....YO!!!!!
Haven't heard from Mike lately, aliens musta took im'!!
Two Shoes
When will the rain end!!!
Terry <tls8323@cs.com>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 14:22:05 (ZULU) (your host address:
152.163.213.191)
dats Herr Kressibucher in the film,
AWESOME PIX - Love the one of Rod, he actually looks tired (musta been waiting for me to climb the hill after the stalk)!!!!!!!!
Guys you wanna do good S-T-U-D-Y those pix, the BTDT crowd will get
some chuckles from a couple of the well used snail trails.
Sir Wes,
The VSS and others are still being made according to my product
C-D and latest Big Green catalogue.
Chao!
peteR <PNGREIFF@AOL.COM>
BIG CITY, BY-GAWD, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 14:23:14 (ZULU)
(your host address: 205.188.196.54)
Dude - there's looottts of unused trails there too... all depends on what yer willing to put up with to not get busted. Go for the briars - no one in their right mind will go there. Of course - you have to work those cutters or your ghillie will generate lots of overhead movement gettin' tangled. You also pickup lots of natural veg without alot of effort :)
Lemme tell ya - Rod was hot that day - he was bustin' 'em left and right...
Ken :)
Ken
Hunter <Rogue308@Riflemen.net>
Grey and Rainy but Peaceful, Northern Va, USA - Sunday, February 25,
2001 at 14:55:05 (ZULU) (your host address: 207.233.164.10)
Take a look at the very last picture - you coudl hide a herd of well
trained cattle in that field :)
(ducking...)
Ken :)
Ken
Hunter <Rogue308@Riflemen.net>
Nokesville, Va, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 14:58:47 (ZULU)
(your host address: 207.233.164.10)
Steve Grasscrawler: I've sent a few thousand bucks worth of stuff
to and from guys on the emporium. Never had a problem. Say a guy decided
to screw someone out of a few grand, would he target a sniper site?
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 15:02:40 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
The lower right corner of the pix LOOKS AWFUL FAMILIAR TO ME........
about twenty yards ahead of spotter, approx five yards to his right
I think.
You're right on the cattle, it hid 'Lito OK - RTLMAO
peteR <PNGREIFF@AOL.COM>
BIG CITY, BY-GAWD, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 15:06:29 (ZULU)
(your host address: 205.188.196.37)
Who was wearing that patchy looking camo? I gotta have some of that to add to my collection!
If you planned on going through the briar patch, why not just dump the ghillie and wear some regular old canvas briar proof stuff? Or, maybe I'm not reading the stalk area right.
WHERE ARE THE SHEEPIES?
Bolt out!
Bolt <reeldoctor@mindspring.com>
NC, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 16:17:03 (ZULU) (your host address:
63.50.54.252)
Big Will
Big -
1 - Go to range.
2 - Load mag to capacity.
3 - Point weapon at target.
4 - Insert mag into mag well.
5 - Rack the bolt and release the safety.
6 - Aim at target.
7 - Pull the trigger.
8 - Smile.
9 - Repeat 6, 7 & 8 until mag is empty.
10 - Repeat 2 through 9 until you are out of ammo.
11 - Go home and run patch of Hoppes #9 down barrel followed by
dry patches until clean.
12 - Apply small dab of Hoppes #9 behind your ear (or any other
appropriate location) to entice wife and/or girlfriend to ignore where
you have been for the last five hours.
13 - Repeat 1 through 12 each weekend for the rest of your life.
Moe
Moe Mensale <mjmensale@aol.com>
Boca Raton, FL, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 16:21:05 (ZULU)
(your host address: 205.188.192.21)
Thanks for the replies on the Remingtons and CZ actions. I've been pretty happy with CZ products, too. I was interested that they have a heavy barrel "Varmint" model. ONLY caliber offered is .308! Guess varmints can come on two legs, too...
Try not to hate me. I'm headed to the range that's 6 miles from the house. Yesterday was 78 degrees in the sun. Today looks headed for the same.
Which one of you folks got together and stole Oregon's rain?
Suppose I should give you a big "thanks".
More later.
Wes
Wes Howe <wsaa@proaxis.com>
Blodgett, OR, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 16:26:15 (ZULU) (your
host address: 198.145.248.102)
PeteR: I could swear that was your big toe sticking out of that briar
patch. Oh well it must have been Jack the snake trying to get up that snail
trail.
TonyY <ayackowski@pershing.com>
Woodbridge, NJ, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 16:28:00 (ZULU)
(your host address: 32.97.88.102)
HA! more like 120 degrees, at least in my "burlap body bag". This
year I will leave EVERYTHING(bold & underlined) up on the hill except
rifle, blanks, and camelback!!!! That haul back n forth plum wore me out.
another lesson learned for another day.
peteR <PNGREIFF@AOL.COM>
BIG CITY, BY-GAWD, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 16:46:55 (ZULU)
(your host address: 152.163.213.186)
Those dudes went thru: SS1, SS2, the trainup then the competition.
They worked really well as a team.
Back to house cleaning :)
Ken
Ken
Hunter <Rogue308@Riflemen.net>
Cleaning the Major's house, in Northern VA, USA - Sunday, February
25, 2001 at 16:49:55 (ZULU) (your host address: 207.233.164.10)
Joe,
Yanni? Dude, you just busted your own balls. Also, until you've
performed their works extensively, leave Bach and Beethoven out of your
posts. It doesn't impress anyone. I've e-mailed 'Lito a couple times and
he'll school you on music just as much as shooting, optics, writing etc.
Later
Rich S. <RS1441@aol.com>
waiting to get off the waiting list at Ft. Meade in, MD, USA - Sunday,
February 25, 2001 at 17:47:10 (ZULU) (your host address: 152.163.201.181)
Man, those brier patches make me go all pitty-pat... I know what "Brair Rabbit" meant when he said "Oh Mr. Fox... Pleeeeeeez don't throw me in that Brier Patch!" ;)
Bolt-ster Dude...
>>"WHERE ARE THE SHEEPIES? "<<
Why, lying back, smokin' a cigarette, you silly ;))
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
I can taste it in the air... "It's loadin' time", in the, USA - Sunday,
February 25, 2001 at 18:31:18 (ZULU) (your host address: 208.249.180.58)
I have got to have some of those funky cammies!! Anybody got an email
addy for the Swedish Sniper Dudes?
357, Model 19 Smith, tuned to baby's butt smoothness! Half a dozen
reloaders, couple boxes of SWC's and you're in business.
Got's me an idee for that thar brar and bramble thicket! Hehehe,
old trick from Eastern NC quail hunting days. Best watch that thicket hard
this year Rod!
You guys that get hot in those ghillies might want to ponder the
cool vests that we wear under hazmat gear. Makes you all tingly inside!
Back to the grease pit, Bolt out!
Bolt <reeldoctor@mindspring.com>
NC, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 21:07:40 (ZULU) (your host address:
63.50.54.43)
The .300WM 190 gr. Federal loads will track VERY closely with the M-3 220 gr .300WM turret (ugh - "Cam"). So will carefully developed handloads at about 2900 fps. The powders of choice are either RE-22, H-4831SC or H-1000 (Vargets big brother).
Patron 'Lito worked out all the fancy plutofication stuff and simply said use the "Meters" hash marks for yards (300Meters REALLY means 300YARDS)SO FAR it has worked quite well for me.
'Lito any word from Leupold on the revised turrets??????
Chao!
peteR <PNGREIFF@AOL.COM>
loading some .300 RUMS in BIG CITY, BY-GAWD, USA - Sunday, February
25, 2001 at 21:21:49 (ZULU) (your host address: 152.163.201.188)
Haven't been reading posts here for about a month so don't know if
you all know, but the movie "Enemy at the Gates" (about the famous Russian
vs German sniper duel in Stalingrad) comes out Friday. Looks good, realistic,
etc from the trailers I've seen here at work. Will see how it turns out.
Brian Fulton <blfulton45@hotmail.com>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 22:51:21 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.152.131.100)
Thanks,
Eric
Eric <alpine@coslink.com>
Mich, USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 23:35:49 (ZULU) (your host
address: 64.68.236.8)
Thanks for the advice!
James
James <eeshooter@usa.net>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 23:51:29 (ZULU) (your host address:
129.186.205.238)
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
USA - Sunday, February 25, 2001 at 23:53:52 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
Michael <bigugly@att.net>
Vista, Ca., USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 00:33:10 (ZULU) (your
host address: 12.72.200.123)
Exiting wheelgun country
outa here
Markwell <markwell@hardynet.com>
spinning cylinders in the gun room in the Alleghenies on day 51.!,
WV, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 01:12:30 (ZULU) (your host address:
63.67.241.190)
Bruce So the truth is out, you gave a price and Lito was to darn cheap to buy!
Mike Miller II Must have missed your target question, but on cheap targets, design what you want, go see a welder. We do that all the time and have them weld up the iron maidens we want. Make sure he uses armor plate steel and not mild cold rolled. It also needs to be 3/8 or larger with half being better if fired at, at closer ranges. You may be surprised how cheap they can be. Ours are full armor at half inch full sized e types with stands to get them about 6 foot tall. Cost 225.00. Can be had cheaper for thinner steel and not super hard, or if target is to be a popper or plate. One of the steel intelligent guys can give you specifics on Rockwell or whatever. Have it at work but not here at the house.
Lito Me thinks that Steve has watched too many TV news casts that exaggerate the risk of the gun culture.
Pete That field looked ok to me the last time I studied it. :-)
Ken The briars hurt a few guys a couple of years back! :-) (Undude?)
Now moving to higher ground with good cover and concealment!
Rick
Rick <rbowcher@aol.com>
Fayetteville, NC, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 01:29:05 (ZULU)
(your host address: 205.188.193.58)
Remember that comment a few posts back about the Major becoming a chuck widow? Well - I mentioned going with the gentleman up in WVa to her in an email. Check out the response she sent back:
"If you whistle, they will sit up to look to see where the dog is.....
Then you can pop them. They cause a lot of damage to a farmer's
field. I would love to go up to Seneca Rocks...."
Heck - I might be able to get her to go too when she gets back. Damn - that will be 2 chuck rifles that I have to locate...
Lookin for chuck rifles, chucks, waitin' for the Major to get home.
Ken :)
Ken Hunter <Rogue308@Riflemen.net>
Looking for that Chuck Rifle, Dark & Windy Northern Va, USA - Monday,
February 26, 2001 at 01:37:24 (ZULU) (your host address: 207.233.164.10)
Thanks for the input about selling my weapon in the Emporium.
Please excuse me if I seem paranoid. The only experience I have ever had in buying firearms is at gun stores... I've never sold one. I need to be at ease before I can let my guard down. There is so much slease and misrepresentation on the internet you can't tell who to trust.
Both you and others who have emailed have educated me about the transactions
you've been involved in and have put my mind at ease (mostly
Thanks again,
Steve
Steve <grasscrawler@hotmail.com>
Somewhere, Kentucky, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 01:55:29 (ZULU)
(your host address: 204.255.230.15)
Ken (Chainsaw)...
"... I would love to go up to Seneca Rocks..."
Heck - I might be able to get her to go too when she gets back.
Damn - that will be 2 chuck rifles that I have to locate...
Lookin for chuck rifles, chucks, waitin' for the Major to get home.
"
Jeez, gotta buy TWO chuck riffles... Man, some guys have it real bad, but you are noble to endure it ;)
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 01:58:47 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.92)
Smiley <mtlsmith@pacbell.net>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 02:04:19 (ZULU) (your host address:
64.160.52.68)
Glad I wasn't there yesterday when Brand was shooting.
Went this afternoon.....1st time I had to crank 7moa into that piddly
little 22. Slight easterly breeeeeeeeeeeeeeze.
Mike <appspec1@aol.com>
Granbury, Texas, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 02:08:41 (ZULU)
(your host address: 172.168.194.130)
Ditto for me on what CDC and Pablito stated. I have also purchased and sold a large amount of equipment through the emporium and I have never been burned. In fact, I have gotten some really great deals. I would venture to say that the majority of folks here are mighty upstanding.
Michael
michael <mike1000@pacbell.net>
SJ, CA, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 03:05:59 (ZULU) (your host
address: 63.192.208.6)
Game rifles are the easiest to justify to ones spouse based on the
old groceries in the freezer argument. " just think of all the money we
save by eating venison!" Haven't ever figured the cost per pound but I
know beef is cheaper. The cost per chuck would probably give one considerable
pause for thought if anyone was dumb enough to calculate it...The time
afield, as we all know, is priceless. And man, when that chuck sails off
that rock at the shot, well.........
Enjoy your pursuit of the new smokepoles...Calibers???
outa here
Markwell <markwell@hardynet.com>
Reckon I'll start dusting off the varmint battery in the Alleghenies
on day 51, WV, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 03:31:52 (ZULU) (your
host address: 63.67.241.211)
Which one of you folks got together and stole Oregon's rain?"
Sir Wes -
You need to verify your GPS coordinates. You do not live in Florida. I lived in Medford (Eagles Point, actually) in early 1992 and it never got to 78 degrees in Feb/Mar. You obviously got stuck in some time/place inversion factor.
If I didn't need to earn a living, I might consider returning. There's some very nice country out there.
Moe
Moe Mensale <mjmensale@aol.com>
Boca Raton, FL, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 03:59:43 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.12.102.181)
When a young man's fancy turns to blowing-up large rodents with high
velocity projectiles.
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 04:04:43 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
I have a pretty hard eye on the winchester stealth in .223
Let me ask you and the rest of the hogs this one: Seems like the
lighter 130'ish? grain boolets in .308 would do well on those little varmints.....
why or why not...??.. seems like the hyper drive .22's are the popular
caliber for chucks and crows.
Ken
Ken Hunter <Rogue308@Riflemen.net>
Gettin' varmint fever, in Northern VA, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001
at 04:12:34 (ZULU) (your host address: 207.233.164.10)
Two Shoes
Terry <tls8323@cs.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 04:14:06 (ZULU) (your host address:
152.163.201.212)
This has been a strange year for Oregon weather. So far we have only 50% of our rainfall that we normally recieve. Outside of one cold snap the weather has been almost spring like the last few days. Plants are starting to form blooms and bulbs are showing signs of growning. REALLY WIERD!
The coast range, where I live, normally recieves 70-80 inches a year.
Love this country, though. Only thing that would make it better would be if we had PA groundhogs to shoot...:-)
Semper Fi,
Wes
Wes Howe <wsaa@proaxis.com>
Blodgett, OR, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 04:32:29 (ZULU) (your
host address: 198.145.249.21)
I have had to either return or take every one I have purchased to the factory warranty service either BEfore shooting, or after a couple of hundred rounds.( the last 4).
ALL PSS models.......
Fortunately for me, they were either replaced(one), or corrective
action was taken.
Once corrected .5 moa, and below is normal......
Problem is, their acceptable accuracy standards aren't acceptable........
They consider your 2" group, to be acceptable.
This has all transpired since the D***** people purchased the company.......
Your problem, from what I'm reading is your chamber is indeed crooked........
This was a MAjor fopah several months back with the intro of the
Rum's........300's, and .338's....
Seems as if it bled over...........same story with the detachable
mag models.
Didn't accept the fact they fopahed them either, and left Joe Consumer hanging by the dimpled chad's........
I'll NOT buy another....only (used) for builders..........
Sorry for your dilema......
Two Shoes
Terry <tls8323@cs.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 04:34:11 (ZULU) (your host address:
152.163.201.212)
Are you feeling the need for speed????
I been cogitating loading some 155 A-Max's in the .300 RUM for just such an occasion. Wonder what kind of velocity I might get, and what it would do to a whistle pig??????
For what its worth, the first 5 shot group from my .300RUM @ 100 yards went EASILY under 3/4MOA. The following four groups stayed under, or at right 3/4 MOA. Thats OEM rifle with OEM ammo.
But it took a while to get out the copper fouling........
chao!
peteR <PNGREIFF@AOL.COM>
BIG CITY, BY-GAWD, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 11:48:00 (ZULU)
(your host address: 205.188.197.57)
For the following size targets when does one become unable to range accurately using the standard USMC MilDot reticle (assume 10 power Leupold and 25 yards increment on ranging limitation).
9", 18" 36" 72"
Thanks
Dave "Doc" King
Dave "Doc" King <David_L_King@Yahoo.Com>
Damascus, MD, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 12:54:42 (ZULU) (your
host address: 131.158.166.157)
New project is a 700VS in .22-250...Have had several .22-250s over the years and decided to get back into that caliber this winter. Decided to go for a bit more reach. Initial results are promising..My old 16X loopy should be back from Or. soon. Was giving me REALLY eratic groups in initial testing..Switched it out for a old 12X and the problem was obvious..After many years, something let go inside the 16..It's on its way back as I peck. Load development continues..Am shooting for something close to 3600fps with 55gr. BTs..groups so far have been running sub 1". Had to clean up the bbl. channel in the stock and relieve some pressure on the magazine box from the trigger guard/floor plate which wouldn't seat properly..A bit of file work solved the problems.
Bruce..'Lito's a piker; I'll give you $30 for thw skull...
outa here
Markwell <markwell@hardyney.com>
Wind's blowing hard enough to blow a 20 pounder off a rock in the Alleghenies..,
WV, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 13:53:00 (ZULU) (your host address:
63.67.241.174)
The following, is a copy and pasted, body of text sent to me by "Slim" and my response to him sent via e-mail.
I initially sent him a copy of the SC Warning to Minors and Militants
after seeing his posting the other day. Here is what he wrote back:
>From: Randy McNutt MY RESPONSE: sent via e-mail:
"SLIM,"
Ok, you want some advice?
1. Learn to spell, punctuate and use gramatically correct sentences.
This does not sound like somebody I want humpin the bush with me.
Oh and hint #5...........Do not tell your recruiter or DI at boot
camp you joined the Army or Corp to be a sniper.......because if they are
worth their salt they'll bounce you like the psychotic you probably are.
This does not mean I beleive my fellow snipers to be psychotic. I
do, however, want to suggest that some teenager, who comes to me saying
he wants to be a sniper probably has some over inflated concept of what
the job actually is and has an admiration for the TV version of somebodies
head caught in a crosshair.
Snipers (true/ actual snipers) are groomed from within the ranks
and have distinguished themselves while paying their dues in line companies.
They are usually the product of years of disciplined training in basic
and advanced combat operations, gleemed from attending numerous high speed,
low drag schools. They have demonstrated a universal understanding and
competency of combat operations and have displayed the ability to adapt
to dynamic battlefield and non battelfield environments.
There is also a considerable amount of actual intelligence in the
sniper. Here is the rule plain and simple: Smart snipers survive; Dumb
snipers.............Die. Usually quite quickly as a matter of fact.
Oh and if any of the words I used were difficult to understand or
pronounce; Take it as a sign (refer back to item #3 above.
Mark
Sorry about the salacious abuse of the bandwidth, I just thought
you would like to know.
SEMPER PRIMUS!
HA!
Prairie dogs may not be smart but they are damn tough targets to
hit past 300yds out here on the prairie. Try hitting a 3 or 4" wide target
with a good cross wind while shooting over two or three draws that cut
at odd angles across your bullets path. Its a real eye opener!! I'll bet
'lito can tell you some stories about judging wind out here on the prairie(HA).
Ken..
Yote Bate..
Sorry to hear your tale of woe, but if you read back in the Roster
Archives for the past two years, you will read a LOT OF THIS...
Remington has had a lot of changes since they were taken over by
Stren... they don't do 90% of the repairs anymore... they "Triage" it out
to little shops around the country.
You call Illion-NY, you get a phone "tech" in Virginia, who was selling
car parts 6 months ago.
It has been the normal state of affairs for several years... some
riffles are good, but many are bad.
Winchester had these kind of problems many years ago, but they have
got their stuff together... every Winchester I've gotten (five), has been
110% right out of the box... I still by Remington riffles, but only the
40 series now.
I would suggest you sell it, and move on to something better, or
trade it for something used from a shop that will let you try it, or return
what you get.
Or try this... send it to Remington, and tell them the barrel stinks,
and you want a new barrel put on (at your expense)... don't spread it around,
but they will give you a totally new gun (on your old stock), for under
$200...
Markwell...
Prime Woodchuck runs 'bout $197 a pound up here ;))
But the time spent under a tree on a hill... with a friend or your
son, glassing the alfa, and talkin about nothin'... PRICELESS!!!
Ken (chainsaw ;)
On 130 boolets... they are really for light deer, and antelope, and
don't expand on varmints... and the .30 cal 110gr "varmint" boolets aren't
too accurate, and the BC is so poor, that they loose velocity, and drop
fast.
I repeat... "You N-E-E-D two M70 Stealths in .223."
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
If anyone can give him the good shift kick in the ass he needs then
it's the DI's at the island. Maybe, just maybe, they will knowck some sence
into him and "Help" him into manhood. If not, they will section 8 him and
nothing lost. Hell, being a boot will probably be the FIRST time ANYONE
has made him take some responsabiy !
KC
Ah too, had a dream, I was on the internet bidding on a M1a! My wife
was shaking me awake saying, "That thing cost HOOOOW MUCH?" "But Darling
everyone is getting a M1a at the playground. YOu wouldn't want your little
boy to be the only kid on the block without one would you!" OmyGod, the
bill is in the E-mail this morning! And I thought it was only a dream!
Wes, maybe we can get a buddy rate?
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
Tony Y - How could I have been passing O2 out when I was the last
guy out of the stalk field with a big, dirty grin on my face PeteR, Team Mussack, "Doc" King, Tony, Ken, Team Sweden, Markwell
and all the rest of you... hope to see you at the 2001 competition. I took
all my lessons home and I'm better trained than last year... which means
I might be able to shoot half as well as Doc and maybe I can hit a mover...
(check out the scores). And if not, I'll make damn sure I'm shooting at
the mover targets directly above Danny R, so he can help me out like he
did the Swedes last year!!!!
Sure hope you are all ready to make it a close match, wouldn't want
my win to be too easy. How will I learn humility?
Jim Mitchell <medicjim86@hotmail.com>
Denney
I take it from Litos' remarks about remington, and the poor service
and poor rifles that a m70 stealth would be my better choice. but what
about a savage or a tikka? Does tikka make heavy barreled rifles or just
light weight sporting kinds? Are the police700 rifles or any better quality
than the 700VS and 700sendero. Please help me out on this. Also is it a
rule to shoot everty AR type rifle with hundreds of rounds and then clean
or only chromelined ones?
What is the best sort of 1911 to own, anyone?
THANKS FOR YOU TIME!
For you'z bumz that have wasted your mis-spent youth on ground squirrels,
PD's, and picket pins... and think chucks are little... go here:
http://www.aspiringtech.net/Pablito/momma-lion-chuck.jpg and
A chuck like this will maybe go 25 pounds, and can tear up a farmer's
dog (or a 'yote) somethin' terrible!
The ugly guy holding it, is our own "Mr Mildot" Bruce...
For the scull, go here:
http://www.aspiringtech.net/Pablito/killer-skull.jpg
I went and offered him $47.68 (I busticated the rugrats piggy bank),
but still got turned down :((
Jeez, I can't cut no deals on Sniper Country ;((
And would that pissy lady from P.E.T.A. stop e-mailin' me... I DIDN'T
SHOOT IT!!!
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
http://www.aspiringtech.net/Pablito/momma-lion-chuck.jpg
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
Thanks in advance.
KC in Dallas...IMHO the LTR with 20" bbl would be ideal for LE..Lighter,
handier, shorter for moving in and around structures than a big gun..Velocity
loss should be no big deal at Typical LE ranges..Recoil is not bad at all...I
shoot one a fair amount and am slight of build and have no trouble..I'd
put a 3.5x10 LR][M1 orM3] or a 6X MK 4[if you can find one] on it. I think
it would serve you well..DON'T get the DM model, get a floor plate..
Jim Mitchel...Anyone who comes to the Storm match had better be humble
as the wind gods are fickle and Rod has a keen eye..Plus, where else can
can one embarras[sp?] himself in such good company? See you in Sept.. Healed
up or not, I'll be there...Hope they slow the movers a bit this year!!!!!!!
Wind's died, the suns out, and I've got no ride to the bench..Bummer!
outa here
Markwell <markwell@hardynet.com>
Bravo thanks for the e-mails realy helpful.
I hope to become a regular as I shoot all types or rifles and pistols
and handload too. I am interested in doing some matches when I get my .308
m70 stealth is that a good match gun or shoud I go to 7mag? I already have
those dies and brass. Also what types of matches can you enter with a .223
auto? I once had a sweet 110 savage 223 tactical rifle It had a lightened
trigger and a big burrus target scope, but, It fell victom to theives.
You know who you are you mfrs! they also got my SWEET Belgum made browning
2000 model 12 gauge. Lots of clays have fell unharmed and unchiped even
since, it really breaks my heart.
Any one know of any chuckhunting or groundhog hunting spots around
Salsbury, NC? or Rockwell even better?
THANKS ALL
'lito thanks for the warning on remingtons they have went south havn't
they, (I hate my 1100 it lets the clays fall unharmed as oposed to the
browning metioned earlier) but all have in some respect. Hell most cars
are made of all different grades of steel melted down and cost 10 times
as mush as the old 30s-70s models wich came from steel made from out of
the mines.
Ya'll, I would say the best Remingtons are the stainless Sendero's
and VSS or VSSF models. I've sXXT canned all my PSS's. Unless you George
or somebody to work on it. It's like a 1911 Colt. It's a kit gun! (he he
he!) INcoming!
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
Yeah... another PSS ;))
Actually, their problems aren't with being delicate... just workmanship
issues... it will hold up just fine.
On PSS's... read what 'yote Bate said (also sometimes known [by the
IRS, and the local Judge] as Bill rogers)... he's right on. The PSS used
to be the top of the 700 line, now it's the bottom of the barrel.
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
I know that this isnt "sniper" related exactly but I've decided to
tap KNOWLEDGABLE sources (you guys) for info..
My company (Army Reserve) is going to the rifle range in 3 months
and have found out that I am going to be teaching BZO, marksmanship refresher
class, etc...
We dont have any of the 25M BZO targets for the M16A2's, and our
pubs room doesnt have any relevant pubs that I can reference the NSN for
this item.
(Supply and admin people are clueless - we're an ENGINEER unit.)
Any one got the NSN for the 25M BZO targets?
Thanks,
I need some advice,
Big Will
Big -
The point I was trying to make with my "highly detailed" cleaning
procedure is that that chrome lined barrel is extremely durable. The chrome
provides an extremely slippery surface that reduces the build-up of deposits
normally left behind by the bullet. If you are using quality ammo, you
will find very little residue left behind after shooting hundreds of rounds.
I once went 2,000 rounds without cleaning - 2 patches of #9 cleaned
it right up. As a rule, though, I clean my weapons after each shoot - I
just don't spend hours doing it.
Moe
Currently I have a Harris 9"-13" swivel model mounted on my Rem 700P.
Last week I went prone at the range (on the 9" height) and noticed that
the back of my neck was getting strained trying to get a good cheek weld.
Is the shorter (6"-9") model preferred for prone shooting (not benchrest)?
I would have assumed the taller model would give you more options to get
onto your target.
Moe
I used to use the 9"-13", but went to the 6"-9", and like it better...
a lot of other guys have done the same.
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
-Chris Pell
Ditto Lito. 6"-9" is the way to go.
I also have some questions about the AR-15. About a year ago I bought
a NIB Colt match target lightweight 16 inch barrel AR. Since I have had
hours and hours of fun with it. Too the tune of about 2500 rounds. At what
point should I start to worry about replacing the barrel. I know this is
not a "sniper rifle" but the people on this sight seem very in tune with
guns period.
Thanks again,
P.S
Eric <alpine@coslink.com>
Outa here
Brian
PS-did not buy this one for myself, came as a birthday gift about
10 years ago. Love my Remingtons, but I do have one ruger that shoots,
that is not a revolver.
Has anyone tried the FN Police Stealth copy? Looks like a claw extractor
stealth with a chrome coated bore and SS guts. I have one on the way and
will keep everyone posted.
Remington problems - I have had similar experiences with Remington
customer service or lack their of. You just have to hound them to death
and eventualy they will fix it, but you have to have already diagnosed
the problem first. Sent my 3 1/2" 870 back three times for feeding problems
before they replaced it. For the $80 in calls and the hastle remington
can keep their stuff as far as I am concerned. I agree with lito an others
that Winchester is producing very good stuff right now.
Take Care
Titan
Jeff Cooper
Argue with him.
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
Thanks again,
Eric -
If your barrel is chrome lined, you are good to go for 15-20,000
rounds. Just follow the "explicit" cleaning directions I gave to Big Will
(especially the dab behind the ear).
New barrel assemblies (with everything up to the barrel nut) only
go for about $150.
Moe
Moe Mensale <mjmensale@aol.com>
That's okay cause one of these days I'm gonna need cheap actions
for when I rebarreling a rifle for my own personal collection.
Today was my first day using the lathes at the local Junior College!
What little time I had turning down a little piece of 1 inch bar stock
was enough to have me day dreaming of the day when I get to turn barrels
for building my own AR uppers or rebarreling bolt actions. I'm chomping
at the bit guys! Hopefully I'm going to be part of "the next generation"
of gun builders.
I'm a little too broke right now to be buying up Remingtons that
don't hold up to factory claims but hopefully soon! Gonna need something
to work with when turning out barrel burning varmint chamberings.
I'm just not looking forward to the day when I am out shopping for
a lathe and mill.
And yes, it's a wonderful experience to be back up at the old Junior
College, guys I'm not that old but being back up there is making me feel
like it.
Those of you on the Roster reading this and are out there turning
barrels and making precision guns(your names have been mentioned several
times here in the past so they shouldn't need repeating), I'd like to know
how you got started. Did you become a certified machinist first? What other
courses or classes did you take that got you where you are today? Did you
ever work for one of the "big guys" and work for one of the gun companies
like Winchester or Remington? What kind of equipment do you use and recommend?
Much thanks in advance, go ahead and shoot me an email if you have
the time.
Bill - Actually 54 and still going strong....I think.....can't remeber
now though....WHAT WAS THE QUESTION????? Miling WHAT?
Rick
Rick <rbowcher@aol.com>
I should be at THIS YEARS Rendezvous again, would not miss it for
the world. The stories at evening chow time are almost as good as the events.
Humility Lesson???
Master Rick wrote,
You slay me DUDE! :-)) hOPE TO SEE YOU THIS YEAR!
peteR <PNGREIFF@AOL.COM>
On the PSS rag,Rem is the problem.........as MASTER lito' said.
The ones I had problems with were minor, but who needs the hassle???......
In fairness to the PSS .308's, they WILL shoot durn good.
AS I alluded to in an earlier post, I have never owned one that would
NOT consistently shoot .5 moa...........or better.
So, before everyone gets their t*** in a wringer, don't...if yours
shoots,,,,,,keep it.
I've yet to try the Stealth model, I like what I have seen, but I
have always been a Remmie 700 guy.......
Old habits die hard.........
fwiw
Two Shoes
Wondering how our Brit buddy is doing, Bolt out!
Ken Hunter, why go all the way up to Pennsylvania? Have you seen
the porker groundhogs they have at Quantico and Belvoir? They've got cigarette
packs in their rolled up T-shirt sleeves -- the last one I was gawking
at stopped his puffing and asked "What're YOU lookin' at?"! 15 pound fuzzy
Shwarzennegers with attitude, indeed! There's gotta be guys out there in
Virginia horse country willin' to let you whack 'em.
On the chrome-lined AR break-in, I concur with Moe -- except change
the barrel out whenever your chamber throat wears out and no longer gives
you minute-of-E-type silhouette, around 7,500 to 10,000 depending on your
barrel wear.
Don't use a Jewell AR trigger in a combat rifle. I've had the hammer
pins walk out and then lock up the action. Maybe put in JP anti-walk pins.
Sinister <david.liwanag@usarec.army.mil>
As a confessed lurker, I have a serious question for you all- I have
found that I N-E-E-D another rifle. I am looking to order soon a semi custom
chambered in 6.5 X 284. I am looking for suggestions on barrel twist vs.
bullet weight, as well as pet loads anyone has had success with. Anyone
have any opinion of the HS Precision HTR? I have an older HS in .308 and
it really shoots (when the nut behind the trigger behaves). Any thoughts
shared are appreciated. Thanks for your time.
BT
Think you need a nice "PYTHON", you know like, well like the one
I have right here for example. Smoooth as it's name, with an action like
butter. Gloss black blueing early numbers #69xxx. Two barrels 6" and 4",
ajustable sights, pac grip, throw in a pair speed loaders and a modified
20mm ammo can that makes the almost bullit proff case, have holsters to
if needed.
***Missing all my kids***
Tim
Moe- Bi pods, Moe keep it low.
You won't be sorry if you go with a 6.5x284. They are a great long
range rifle. If you plan to do long range shooting with the 140s I would
go with the 1-8 twist and you can't go wrong with most of the slower powders.
I have tried RL-22 and N-165 and H-4831SC they all shoot equally well.
As for the H&S rifle ditto!! I have shot several of their rifles
and they shoot well. I don't know if they have decided on a reamer yet
for the 6.5x284s. The last time I talked to Janet they were trying to decide
on the right reamer size because of all the different brass deminsions
out there. I know they make their own reamers inhouse. I would love to
try one of JRs barrels in the 6.5x284.
Please, let it be true, so that I might learn and not become complacent.
Jim Mitchell <medicjim86@hotmail.com>
Had a call from Geoff Corn. My M1A arrived for the "Bravo" treatment.
Needed to give it a try. Besides I've always been a fan of the M-14 system.
As Bravo says; "NOW you'll have a spotter rifle".
On the Remington note:
I've sold a number to LE guys and they all seem happy with the PSS.
Some VS models, as well. All shoot equally well.
My personal 700's are all on actions at least 15 years old so I can't
personally comment on the current quality. On the other hand, I have been
hearing rumors. I tend to find the old ones and build on that platform...
Semper Fi,
Wes
How many times have you heard someone bad mouth a product not knowing
that you have or have had one and it worked perfectly fine? How many of
those complaints are actually user induced? Is anybody or anything perfect?
If you were to judge products based on a few (probably less than
1%, compared to the hundreds of thousands or millions built)then what do
you think your next rifle would be built on if you consider;
Savage's aren't as good as Remingtons or Winchesters!
Sure glad I have one or two Marlin's or Mossberg's laying around,
anyone have a McMillian Tactical stock laying around for my Glenfield?
I think that everyone has a right to be upset and complain when they
don't feel they are being treated fairly buy a manufacturer or repair facility.
And, having been there a time or two myself (luckily not firearms related)
being able to air those feeling helps to relieve some of the frustration
(my opinion). I also believe that those of use seeking knowledge need to
recognise this and as the saying goes, "take it with a grain of salt."
Better get down before I break my soap box....
Byron <byburnham@earthlink.net>
I guess that no-one calls customer service to congratulate them for
giving better than expected value.
There may be QC problems at Big Green, but its not all doom and gloom.
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
This is NOT a few grumblings from less that 1% of the owners about
a few guns... this is a pattern that has been going on for years.
There are certain problems that happen in the course of things...
a trigger that is too heave, a bedding that is a "bit" off... but the problems
that are happining at Rem are very different... stuff id coming out the
door that should never passed first inspection.
Look back over the last thre years of the roster, and you will see
complaints that should have never left the factory... lots of them!
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
Congratulations on graduated 16 of 24 students. Would you share with
us what item(s) give your students the most problems? Is it the shooting
or some other problem that causes the most failures? If you have already
posted this, just direct me to the archives. Thanks.
HDR
HDR <hprudisell@aol.com>
An example of excellent Customer service is Armalite. While I am
sure there are those Armalite Customers that are unhappy for some reason,
I know from first hand experience that they correct problems that are Warrenty
Issues. Even tough I am a AR-10 fan and own a couple, this is not a paid
endosement. LOL
We have to keep in mind that we are splitting hairs here, and that
for the most part the Avg shooter is happy with things none of us will
tolerate. I sincerely hope that someone from Stren/ Remington is reading
this roster and taking these unfavorable coments to heart.
Just my humble opinion, for what its worth....
Titan
Someone had to get lucky. This time it was me.
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
LeMay OUT
L.L.Bean knew all that. Lands' End uses it. Remington doesn't appear
to have picked up on the lesson. There's a big opportunity here for Winchester.
CDC' <criscurt@isu.edu>
Winchester had some of these problems years back... they were in
the original building from the 1800'and it was a disaster... but in '94,
they built a totally new plant, with all new, state of the art machines
and equipment, and now, the demand for Stealths has overwhelmed their ability
to make them.
Remington still has many of the same problems... they are still in
the same building that they were when they made Civil War guns... it's
old, expensive to heat... there cost of doing business is high, and they
have serious labor/union problems... PLUS... they have been bought by a
company that is not commited to guns (sound familar??... think S&W,
Lyman, RCBS, Weaver, and the list goes on).
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
How about some of you guys with more experience in this area list
the top 10 or 15 things you would ALWAYS check if you were looking at a
gun in a shop and going to buy it? (Sniper type rigs...)
I'd rather learn from someone elses mistakes than make my own.
~DakotaAviator
Now there is a possible error on my part of not understanding your
question. Did you mean when the error of a mil reading makes it impossible
to hit or when the mils becomes so inaccurate that they cant hit? If that
is the case then you must compute when the mil reading leaves a gap between
two mil readings that is greater than the next mil reading with its trajectory.
As an example, a 36-inch target leaves a gap of 178 yards between .8(1251yards)
and .7 mils (1429 yards). No matter how good you are, you can not hit a
target that resides in between those two extremes. The trajectory will
not permit it. Essentially when the swept space of one mil range does not
meet the swept space of another mil range then you have reached the probable
error distance for that sized target and that round.
Now is that clear as mud or what?!
Pete The only abject humility will be mine when you young guys
whip my old butt!
Rick
Rick <rbowcher@aol.com>
My opinion:
That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.
Kevin R. Mussack (Andy's Dad) <kmussack@aol.com>
Give us a post man others miss you too!
Moe:
ALL qualified advisors:
I too along with B. DOUGLAS am interested in machining: as far as
gun making please give us both a reply on that. I am planing on joining
the core to spot/snipe if I cant make the score perfect on the PFT (I HAVE
ALL THE OTHER GIFTS FOR IT IM JUST A FAT BODY/STILL CANT DO A PULL UP IF
I EVER GO TO THE BUSH AS AN INFANTRYMAN I WILL HAVE TO TOTE THE FRAPPIN
M-60!) I will chose another MOS like machining or armory like the rifle
builders in Quantico.
All others: Keep up the GOOD work!
Made it all the way through Range 10 on the CD this weekend. Overall
average is still around 5 for 10 first round hits. Average on distances
past 800 yards is about 25%, on distances from 600 to 800 is about 50%,
now up to 100% on all distances below 600 yards. Hits in the red square
are averaging about 50% overall. Most of this is luck me thinks. I start
on the movers next and will go back all the way again. I did not record
any poop on any of the targets so that they will be fresh again.
Main problems I have noticed:
NOT PAYING ATTENTION on dialing windage. Adjusting right when should
be left and vice versa. This is a stupid mistake.
Coming up short on long targets. I am now adding 20 yards to each
shot between 600 and 800 yards and 40 yards from 800 to 1000 yards no matter
what I mil.
The interpolation formulas seem to work well.
It would be nice to have input from those of you that have used the
CD and also have real live experience with milling just to see if they
are truly similar.
After this excercise, I may seriously consider a Shepard scope. It
is really difficult to do this for real with limited range time.
Doing better and learning more, Bolt out!
Bolt <reeldoctor@mindspring.com>
Sorry you're so bored with this thread... but then why would you
want a list of 10 or 15 more boring things that can be wrong?
KC...
Not this public, thank you... I'll get mine in RED boxes... none
of my RED box numbers has ever shot AS BAD as 1"
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
Sallie and David were going to get hitched. Sallie bought David a
SLR8 for an engagement present. Sallie said David cheated on her. Sallie
puts gun up for sale. David titles next post "Marry Me" and in the post
says he's sorry it didn't work out. Is this confusing or what?
Suggestion to David - get down on your hands and knees and beg that
woman to take yo alledged cheatin butt back. Any woman that would buy a
guy a brand spanking new rifle for 'just' an engagement present is a worth
carpet burns. Just think what she would have bought you AFTER you got married!
You could have ended up with a brand spanking new Jerry Rice or Chandler
special! Some folk's youngins I just don't understand.
You single Rosterferians better email this fine lady BEFORE rifle
is sold!
Must be a full moon, Bolt out!
Bolt <reeldoctor@mindspring.com>
I keep readings posts that are talking about stealths,and red boxes.
Thanks,
P.S-
ses
Partison <Partison@hotmail.com>
After reading some of the posts from some of you guys regarding Remmys
quality, I believe that mine is pretty good for the most part. I purchased
my 700 Police last year and have decked it out with the Loopy and the Badgers
ect.. It will shoot 1/2 moa. However, barrel break in SUCKS! I believe
my barrel was the last one machined before they realized the cutter was
getting dull. Machine marks are visible with the naked eye at the muzzle.
Just out of curiousity, can anybody tell me if there is light at the end
of the tunnel? With the rifle shooting this good, I really do not want
to rebarrel at this time. Also, does anyone from TX know where some tac-matches
can be found here in the state.
Thanks Deno
What fool doesn't know what kind of rifle comes in a RED box, besides
MARLINS (same company anyway)???
Does any one else wish that Browning whould fall in and make some
bullbarreleds also? Is the A-bolt reciver worth a hart barrel if they don't?
ANd who whould make a QUALITY stock to house such a rig?
Dont any one start knocking brownings I know the present ones may
be crap but the old BELGUM made ones weren't and look at all the FALs made
by the bigger outfit that is a part of browning or browning is a part of
not sure wich.
My 3 cents: Untill a later date...
Big Will <http://www.Madlogger@hotmail.com>
Coincidence, I'm just back from a deployment (for a couple of weeks
anyway) Thanks for asking but God forbid I'm not a 'SeaHat' (Leg, waterleg
is US I guess)
Slugboy
Big Will...
FN sells a rifle with a Winchester barrel, a M70 claw feed Action,
removable magazine, and a Winchester stock... Hmmmm
'lito
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
Big -
I believe that all AR barrels from the same maker are made out of
the same type steel. End use is the concern. The primary difference is
in the lining, or lack thereof. For example, Colt's standard AR barrels
are chrome lined for durability in military or tactical usage. Their match
barrels are unlined for better accuracy. In a military scenario, you may
not have the luxury of time to clean your barrel after every few rounds
like the bench shooter does! LOL
The same with the chamber. .223 is not 5.56. A match chamber (.223)
is made to tighter tolerances and likes to eat a very specific diet of
match quality ammo. A rifle specifically chambered in 5.56 (military) has
looser tolerances and really doesn't care what you feed it. It's primary
mission is to rock 'n role, not hit the "X" on every shot.
As far as wearing things out, remember that any 5.56 round loaded
to mil specs (IMI M193/M855, Win Q3131A) is going supersonic when it leaves
the muzzle. That sounds a bit fast to me and is probably very good at wearing
things out - hence the chrome lining on military barrels.
BIPODS
Moe
Gooch - Are you still looking for land in NE Alabama? If so I have
a lead for you through a third party. Drop me an Email if you are and I
will give you the details.
Respectfully
Titan
'lito
Got a M118 BDC for my M3 - Suprisingly it tracks the Fed GM2 extraordinarily
well out to 900m. I know it should, but...
Titan 'lito, Moe etc. Diemaco does the same sort of hammer/press
forging with the C7 barrels and they can be sub-MOA.
Like most hot selling products the companies get too big and start
to forget about their customers - until they get a big kick in the ass
- as the sales (and stock) falls.
Kevin of the GWN <bolandks@home.com>
>>>"DakotaAviator...
Bored with the this thread?
Not in the least! I am actually very very interested in this.
Let me rewrite that last post I made, apparently I am not making
my intent clear.
"Ok.. so Remington has their problems..."
"Carpe Diem and all that..."
9 out of 10 guns I have owned were "hand me downs" from relatives
as gifts or payment for work I have done for them. I have not YET had the
pleasure (?) of being able to shop around for a rifle to spend some hard
earned cash on.
What I meant in that earlier post was; what are the top 5, 10, 15
(whatever) things that are most important (even crown, etc) in picking
one rifle over a similar rifle?
Hey, I know airplanes. I know what I will and WONT accept in an aircraft
that I fly, rent, buy. I've got a method and key points that have to work
or at least meet the minimums.
What I dont know yet, at least to the extent that some of you guys
do, is the good and bad little details in buying bolt action rifles.
Enlighten me.
I thank you in advance and appoligize for the misleading post.
DakotaAviator <DakotaAviator@hotmail.com>
Can anyone provide some pictures of the glaring differances
My team commander is not real up to snuff on camoflouge and
I downloaded some of the really good pics from the gallery here but
Pakrat
Caveat Emptor not Carpe Diem...
I blame the fatigue from 4 hours of class and 6 hours of flying today.
I.M.S.A.F.E.
Hardly...
Yup... you gotta explain it to somebody (but especially your teacher)...
"Carpe Diem" means "Seize (or TAKE) the Day"
"Caveat emptor" means "Buyer beware"!!
Though I'll be the first to admit that Latin is a real Achilles'
heel for me.
Don' do so good in 'panish either ;((
---
Kevin of the GWN...
Well, of course Dude
'lito
Two Shoes - yeah, didn't think like that.
Kevin of the GWN <bolandks@home.com>
Happens all the time at the casa de Roger. It's nice to come home
to a box full of stuff that goes boom, but...well, you know.
I was mearly suggesting that the lesser powder capacity of the 223
would permit longer barrel life in any weapon chambered for that round.
Next time don't get so defensive I don't know as much as you GRANTED,
I am new to rifles I am old to shotguns though not that I am a load wizard
for them either, or do I claim to be a big expert.
Secondly 'Lito:
I am sorry for saying that Browning makes FALs, what I meant was
their father company FN desined the original pattern of the FAL to my knowledge.
Big Will <http://www.Madlogger@hotmail.com>
So problem number 1: Crown
Unacceptable.
KC SWAT dog: Save your money on armorers school. Last hour of a three
day course spent on 700. Changing extractor and removing action from stock
are the highlights. Don't ever touch trigger. Nothing said about taking
the barrel off. I got the distinct impression that was also a no-no! :-)
Have fun.
Bill0294 <lhardin21@netscape.net>
Just perused the RSR Wholesale site (www.rsrwholesale.com). They
have Winchester M70 Stealths in .223 (stock #: WN535-027208). No .308's
in stock. Price is competitive with the guys in the Green Box.
Hope this helps those of you looking. MY .223 project is on hold
until I find out what my M25 is going to cost...
For those of you inquiring about the 6.5 X .284 send me a message
off line. I won't waste space here...these guys already know what a great
cartridge it is even if THEY won't convert.
Ever try preaching to a bunch of sinners asking they repent?
Semper Fi,
Wes
"I blame the fatigue from 4 hours of class and 6 hours of flying
today." - Bragger!
P.S. I believe there are a few pilots amung the sneaky footed here.
You mentioned that there were no LE customer service reps. I checked
out their LE contact information webpage and it does show someone listed
in this capacity. The information can be found at http://www.remingtonle.com/supporte intact.htm
.
This still may not help. Even if the rifle was built for military/LE
use (even though available to the general public) their support rep may
say that because you are not a LE agency that you have to deal with general
service reps (have had similar experience with other products).
To ALL,
I believe that someone has all ready touched on the problem. The
company was bought by a group that apparently is not interested in firearms
except from the standpoint of what the profit margin will give them. They
have reduced the quality of the initial product, probably through cut backs
and lessening of quality control checks. They have reduced the level and
quality of customer service. Those at the top are either not being told
the truth with regard to the true current status in these areas or has
choosen to ignore it.
We let our politician know what we think of them before elections
or important measures come before them and maybe it is time that WE do
the same with the Remingtons of the firearms industry. I think that S&W
is a good example of this and hopefully they have gotten the message.
Got to be carefull, I just found out my soap box is made of cardboard
and not wood!
Byron <byburnham@earthlink.net>
I bought a new Winchester a year ago Clasic Super Express. A real
beauty in 416 Rem. Mag. Open sights 3" at 75yds.not bad for a blind old
f--t like me.But I had a problem with the finish I thought it should be
better than it wase.I called a factory rep,he told me to send it back and
thay would look it over. If thay re blued it thay don a darn good job it
looks like thay put a new barrel on it. at eney rate I am pleased as I
can be.
Both rifels ar Works of art.Unlike my X.And I have ben LOL for 3yrs.
now and love every minet I spend with all my new girlfrends and the old
wons to thay only talk when I load them and pull the triger.
Ref: Rough Barrels & Quality
You get what you pay for.
Compared to so many other things in life $3,000 for a world class
long range rifle seems like a real bargin.
Texas Brigade Armory update:
I GOT IT. Finally.....is it worth the wait? Fit and finish is excellent.
Accuracy so far is outstanding with my 700P load of 168MK over 44gr Varget,
adjusted to .010 off lands, shooting in the high .2's. .276 was the best
5 shot group so far - shooting off sandbags using a beanie. I'm more into
handloads right now but three shots of Fed 168GM measured .273. BTW, Fed
GM is .020 off - now that's throat!
Someone a while back wanted to know about Ruger vs S&W 357 mag
snubs. I've owned multiple Ruger and S&W mag snubbies and FWIW the
S&W's are way more user-friendly, IMHO. Rugers are too blocky and clunky
for me, and the fixed sights on all mine were way off.
Put compact boot grips, or Bianchi Lightning grips, on a Mod 19 snub
and it's a fine defense weapon. True, it's only a "six-shooter", but the
old "six-for-sure" argument still has merit, especially when it should
only take one shot per BG with 357 max loads.
Loads: I like 158gr Speer Gold Dot HP's over 10gr of Blue Dot as
an all-around, do everything load. It's a max load that, in my 2 1/2",
will group 2" at 20 yards. I carry mine for defense and to put down wounded
big game.
Wheel guns and bolt action rifles are now what I carry while traveling.
With all the weird gun laws, retro seems a safer way to go while passing
through unknown territories.
flash <skalkaho_flash@hotmail.com>
I'm considering putting a modern scope on my L42A1 in place of the
WWII vintage 4 power issue scope. The rifle is great but the 4 power scope
is not quite up to modern standards and distances -- especiall with my
old eyes. (L42A1 is a 7.62 x 51 mm conversion of the British Mk. IV(T).
It served with British forces and other through the Falklands campaign
and was only replaced with the Accuracy International L96 not too long
ago.)
Any suggestions for scopes? I've considered the Leupold Var-X 3.5x10
Tactical and have been offered a good price on a West German Army surplus
6 power Hensolt (SP?).
Can I use mil-dots with a variable power scope?
Feel free to respond off line.
Thanks.
Frances
Yote Bait..
Bill reference the Shepard, I would love to come up against a guy
at 600 and beyond shooting a Shepard and me with a mil dot. He will be
a hurting puppy because after the he has blazed away missing for the first
several shots. I will know exactly where he is and will only have to shoot
once. We tried the Shepard and the M2 Leupold scope. Both have the same
problem of using a very small target (19 inches) to range on and you are
restricted ot what you can range. As brought up by Pat, the circles get
small and holding for wind is a pain in the butt. At 700 meters and an
8-mph wind you are looking at about a 40 inch hold with only a small circle
for reference. I think that a ten for ten hit rate is a touch optimistic.
Bored would not be the feelings you would have, maybe frustration? :-)
Another problem we had was the Shepard scopes started shifting the zero
cross hair off of the main cross hair. This happened after some time in
the field with it and the normal banging around it got in that environment.
Running from that coyote shooter at this time.
Rick
Rick <rbowcher@aol.com>
Last I heard (on this site), the decision was made to go with a modified
M16A2 type.
I'm curious as to what optics and ammo will be employed. The ACOG
type scope seems to be either configured for a carry handle mount for the
20" bbl or the flat top mount on the M4 bbl.... I would guess a flat top
20" bbl for the DM, no? I guess a new bullet drop reticule configuration
would be in order too? SS109 out of a 20" bbl? Maybe a new 69 grain loading
is in the making?
Pablito, what do you and the rest of you optically oriented types
think of the IOR 6 X 42 tactical scope with the MP-8 reticule for this
application. I would think a 30mm tube would be preferred, but this seems
like a handy little setup for a DM.. The finer lines on the MP-8 reticule
may allow better resolve at 800 yards than a mil dot...
I know I'm talking toys here, but I'm intrigued by the potential
utility of this concept. Heck, someone has to setup the targets for you
guys to shoot at....
back in the trench, the range is hot....
Stealth or the FN Special Police Rifle seems to be just what the
doctor orders, I just wish they would make them also in Left Handed short
action. For the time being the do not even produce the short action in
LH configuration.
I think many buyers would be ready to pay up to 1000 USD IF Remington
would produce a rifle that is ready to go from the box. (OK lawyer proof
trigger they would probably still have to be included to the package).
What is needed: Concentrate on the barrel: Make it smooth on rifling, crown
it well, make a proper chamber that is concentric and straighten the receiver,
maybe add a thicker recoil stop. Done in a factory the extra cost should
be quite minimal so that the 1000 USD rifle would bring better profit margins
AND better reputation for the company. Of course if 2 MOA rifle is acceptable
for the company, then there is not much that can be done cost-efficiently.
Anyway it has been seen all over again that whenever somebody who
does not really like guns buys a gun company, the quality workers and the
qulity of the product go south. This happened with S&W, Colt, Winchester
and now Remington. Luckily sometimes the owners smell the coffee at some
point of time and either increases the quality or sell the company to somebody
that cares. I am glad Sako was bought by Beretta so this quality issue
should not be a problem there.
Hexa
Hexa..... I completely agree with you on the Remington situation.
I have an LTR .308 (floorplate) that shoots better than .75MOA day in and
day out with M852 or GM1 and count myself fortunate. I bought a new Stealth
.308 instead of a PSS, however. The last I heard Remington was still making
the barrels for the M24 SWS and building the complete weapon in-house,
so in theory they are capable of building a quality product. If they elected
to do that, I'd like to be the first in line to buy one. Are you listening,
Big Green?
'lito..... That FN Police Special sounds very interesting. X-Tra
Special if they build it in .300WSM! I feel the urge to experiment;-)
I had two problems with it, one was the short eye relief and on a
300WM that hurts!! The other was after 600yds I found it hard to range
a target and tell exactly which range circle to use because the circles
were pretty close in size after 600yds as I remember.
They are fast though, we used to have local long range shoots and
you were timed as part of your score. With the Shepard and the 300WM I
was nearly unbeatable esp. since we only shot at unknown distance out to
600yds and we shot at IPSC targets. With the 300WM and 190s you really
had to have a bad wind to worry to much about hold off.
I agree with yote bait though, I liked the idea of the circles they
are very fast for something that is the correct size and I would like to
see another company make them without all the other crap he has in there.
When all we shot at was IPSC targets it was the perfect scope but once
they went to steel it was a different story. I had to go back to "guesstamating"
the range and that leveled out the playing field again(HA).
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
Why would you want to mil just any ole object at an unknown distance?
Let's assume that you are not shooting at anything but human targets. Average
would be a 72" target. If you have figgered your range card properly, shouldn't
you just be able to mil the guy when he stepped out, look at your dope
and automatically be on the correct range? In other words:
A 72" target = x mils @ 1000 yards. He steps out and he is x mils
tall which would = range?
Trying to simplify this stuff, Bolt out!
Only real wish would be for the scope to come in a 30mm tube, a little
increase in brightness would be nice at times. Almost forgot, the shep
does have one other nice feature, the stadia lines on the top and side
of the recticle are in inches, no messy mil conversion required and of
course visual confirmation of the side movement for windage adjustment.
Like my mil dot scopes, but for most of my hunting use and plinking
the shep is superior. That is just my opinion and I could be wrong.
Brian
fwiw
Two Shoes
I am new to long range shooting. I have done alot of 100-200 yard
shooting with my AR-15 match target lightwieght. I always used the peep
sights on that gun, and have never really shot alot with a scoped rifle.
By not alot I mean only at 100 yards. I now have a 700VS SF in .308. I
am puting a leupold variXIII 6.5X20X40 on it. This weekend I am invited
to go to a local range with the sniper for our local police force. My question
is if I set my scope up for 300 yards, and then change to a 500 yard target
how do you adjust for that? I know this probably sounds dumb to most of
you. As I have been reading alot on this page and there seems to be some
great long range shooters here. I would appiciate any advice you could
give me on this subject.
Thanks,
P.S
>To: Mark Makers
>Subject: Re: Sniper country "A place to start"
>Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 11:26:58 -0800 (PST)
>
>
>yes yes yes, i read your thing that states about that
>secret service crap. i hav no life left of being a
>kid. i'm using the marines or military as a way out
>of my life. don't just stereotype me and leave me be.
> that pisses me off. tell me answers to what i asked,
>not cheesy phrases that you giv to the spoiled boys
>and girls of todays society.
>
>______________________________________
2. Do not tell people what pisses you off. They will only use it
against you.
3. Take warnings (like the one I sent you) seriously. As a soldier
you will get tons of signs that tell you things (like; hmmm, am I walking
into and ambush) heed the warnings; they are there for a reason.
4. Using the military as a "way out," is not just stupid but a seriously
immature perception of what being a soldier is about. Soldiering is about
responsibility, digging in and holding your ground, honor, respect for
all things (yourself , your family, your fellow soldiers and citizens etc..)
and beleive it or not, your statement about using the military as a way
out suggests you are running away, bugging out, surrendering, hiding when
you should stand up and fight/ take responsibility. It is also about accountability.
In the military running and hiding is not an option.
MARK
Hey Slim: That means "Always First" in Latin (which is a language)
and is the Motto of Pathfinders.
Mark <beouwulf4_hire@hotmail.com>
Wondering what day care center gave out this website's address, And
wondering about the English skills being taught in schools in the good
'Ol, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 14:07:16 (ZULU) (your host address:
147.205.114.36)
Morning Hogs...
Catching up on the roster and all this talk of shooting dogs is
really giving me spring feaver!! We just got another 8" of snow over the
weekend with wind so I can't even call yotes.
Thanks for posting the nice pictures, I enjoyed them!!
Just talked to a kid I know and he was telling me that last weekend
he found a spot where coyotes are trying to snag geese off of some open
water on the ice. He counted over 20 in one bunch but they won't come to
calls and stay about 500yds out on the ice. I have wet dreams about finding
a spot like this and taking my 6.5x284 with a good set of range finders
and unleashing death and distruction upon them. I'll let you know if it
happens.
Pat <mrbullet@hotmail.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 14:51:11 (ZULU) (your host address:
207.41.18.130)
Smiley... :))
It has become usual for the "Green Box" riffles.
You send it to Remington, you get it back from "Freddy's Guns and
Tackle Shoppe".
Their shotguns appear to be unaffected by all this... they are still
very good, but the repair situation is the same. I sent a .410, deluxe
1100 skeet gun to them that would only feed and function if you put two
rounds in it, but would dump all the rounds and jam, if you loaded four...
and got it back from some jerk that couldn't find anything wrong... he
loaded one round, and it feed, and fired ??
A real shooting "Rocket scientist".
If you send a gun to Rem for repair, you MUST... MUST say in the
repair request, that it is to be repaired AT THE REMINGTON REPAIR DEPT...
and not outside the factory, or you are screwed.
I'm with you on the cost of Woodchuck "Per pound" ;)))
When you figure in the cost of a premium Varmint riffle... Lupita
(or Unertl) scope... loading equipment, Brass/bullets/powder/primers...
time working up a load, 4WD vehicle to get up in the good places...
You N-E-E-D two M70 Stealths in .223.
Use V-Max's, at 3300, and you (and Major Kim) will have a ball...
:))
and a bunch of 55 gr V-Max's.
Rummaging around in the sandpit for some cuck shoot stuff... in the
"gettin warmer", USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 15:30:25 (ZULU) (your
host address: 208.249.180.36)
Randy, let the kid join the MARINES !
kc <swatcop911@msn.com>
Dallas, Tx, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 16:02:17 (ZULU) (your
host address: 63.44.237.222)
Pat; wake up! It's morning! ha, Geese and Ice and coyotes! Naw,you
will wake up in a minute.
Brian; I too saw the trailers on the movie. "Enemy at the Gate";
it looks seriously like it might be really good. I have mixed emotions
about all this hollywood attention to Snipers though! Remember the .44
magnum rush when Dirty Harry was introduced. I can see it now! "Attention
Walmart Shoppers, todays special on Sniper Rifles is in aisle 6. See the
Latest in fashionable Camo and Spotting Scopes are on sale for the next
10 minutes with rebate for $19.99 when you buy Federal Match Ammo in 5000
lot cases!"
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 16:08:14 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
Ken Hunter - where are those pics you mentioned... I can't find
a single one of the stalk lanes...
NJ, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 16:47:41 (ZULU) (your host address:
12.20.190.1)
I am buying a remington 700 sendero in 7mm Rem. Mag. This will be
my first 7 mag and i was hoping someone would have some good ammo suggestions.
I dont reload and need good factory ammo. Bullet weight? Design? Also i
was wondering where i could get bullet drop information?
thanks
spyder <neaced@pr.erau.edu>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 17:14:39 (ZULU) (your host address:
206.207.155.163)
Hey y'all,
semper fi
Big Will <http://www.Madlogger@hotmial.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 18:43:19 (ZULU) (your host address:
166.82.1.83)
Hey guys, I ran into a Winchester rifle marked U.S.CF 1917 at what
I believe to be a steal of a price. I can't find any information on this
rifle and Winchester isn't cooperating. Does anyone know the skinny on
this thing like what it might be worth? The end of the barrel is stamped
11 on one side & 18 on the other side. The wood is in excellent shape
with not much blue left on the steel. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Hawg out!
HawgDawg <rjolly@precisionsolarcontrols.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 19:02:24 (ZULU) (your host address:
216.214.221.254)
OK, Ok...
I've gotten lotsa e-mail on the chuck skull thing.
(but I would have ;))
Findin' Chuck riffles in the sandbox :))... and it 48 degrees outside
:)) in the, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 19:10:56 (ZULU) (your host
address: 208.249.180.112)
For the first one... No "AND"
Findin' Chuck riffles in the sandbox :))... and it 48 degrees outside
:)) in the, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 19:13:52 (ZULU) (your host
address: 208.249.180.112)
Any one use Lputa's ARD? Does it effect the quality of the optics?
Does it effectivly cut glare and reflection? Just curious if it is worth
the extra $$$.
Chad <rem700_308win@hotmail.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 19:59:28 (ZULU) (your host address:
63.52.189.48)
Big Will Re. best1911...I'm not going to start it, I'm not!!!!
Wasting away in the gun room on a boootiful day in the Alleghenies,
Big WiWV, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 20:26:00 (ZULU) (yo
ost
address: 63.67.241.58)
Wasup, Fellas, Ladys if any,
Big Will <http://www.Madlogger@hotmail.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 21:20:27 (ZULU) (your host address:
166.82.1.83)
Going to SM for LR Rifle in April. Do I need to take any replacement
parts for my Remington PSS in case somthing should break?
Jim <jjme@westol.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 22:52:14 (ZULU) (your host address:
24.241.39.81)
Doc; "when does one become unable to range accurately using the
standard USMC MilDot reticle"
about age 50 I would say.
YOu got paint? You can make a Sniper rifle out of a Sendero Stainless
that won't quit. If you can find a PSS for sale it will let you down unless
your willing to drop a couple G's to a good gunsmith to get it fixed. Remington
has a serious attitude problem these days or at least your attitude will
have serious problems if you get one of those problems. 2" groups my AXE!
Feller brought me a 94 angle eject Winchester 94 in here the other day
with a box of Remington factory to sight in with a 4 power Bushnell scope.
The 3 shot groups were less than 2".
Some went 1.5".
Tikka, I saw some this weekend, I've seen a hell of a lot worse
than that to make a rifle out of. Saw Winchester's too. Somebody down there
woke up and said "Let's make some guns!"
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 22:58:53 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
Jim...
>>"Going to SM for LR Rifle in April. Do I need to take any replacement
parts for my Remington PSS in case somthing should break?"<<
Maybe they think since the cops aren't spending their own money,
they won't care???
Findin' Chuck riffles in the sandbox :))... and it 48 degrees outside
:)) in the, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 23:10:15 (ZULU) (your host
address: 208.249.180.99)
Markwell; forgot to chastise you for the use of oxymorons! If you
continue to use made up words like! "best 1911's" I will have to start
correcting your posts too! :-)'s X 40. The Devil did that!
Here's a list.
Best 1911's
Good looking Marlin's
Accurate Rugers
reliable Rossi's
Dumb Coyotes
trophy goldfish
clean dumpsters
cheap Hummers
noisy snipers
Lotto winners
Medical Miracles
Ugly women after closin time
+
Just to get you started on the path to recovery!
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 23:14:56 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
Hey all...
(A2's please, NOT the ones for the A1's!)
~Colin
DakotaAviator <DakotaAviator@hotmail.com>
Grand Forks ND, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 23:16:04 (ZULU)
(your host address: 63.31.111.89)
Howdy,
I'm going to buy a M70 Stealth, but I don't know if I should go
for .308, 22-250, or .223. I do basic hunting, and long range shooting.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Mayhem <killare@hotmail.com>
USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 23:45:46 (ZULU) (your host address:
63.23.193.191)
"Also is it a rule to shoot everty AR type rifle with hundreds of
rounds and then clean or only chromelined ones?"
Moe Mensale <mjmensale@aol.com>
Boca Raton, FL, USA - Monday, February 26, 2001 at 23:53:18 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.12.105.48)
Bipods
Moe Mensale <mjmensale@aol.com>
Boca Raton, FL, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 00:05:49 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.12.105.48)
Moe...
Gettin the 6mmBR ready, in varmint country, USA - Tuesday, February
27, 2001 at 00:09:48 (ZULU) (your host address: 208.249.180.99)
I'm lookin into buying a Browning A-bolt II in 223. Have any of
you guys heard anything good bout this rifle? Also, thnx for your help
concerning my .270 Winchester. I sent it to a good smith and he fixed it
up real nice an purty for me :-)
Chris Pell <chrispell2000@hotmail.com>
NY, NY, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 00:13:30 (ZULU) (your host
address: 24.184.105.135)
Moe,
Roger C. <madeditor75@hotmail.com>
Freshly back from the range in Austin, Tx, USA - Tuesday, February
27, 2001 at 00:17:19 (ZULU) (your host address: 24.28.72.177)
I've recieved alot of good advice on this page regarding my purchase
of a new 700VS SF .308. For this I would like to say thanks. I have been
told that the federal gold medal stuff shoots well for factory loads. Does
anyone know where I can gat some for a good price?
Eric
Where can I get .223 ammo in 1000 round lots cheap?
Mich, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 00:18:48 (ZULU) (your host
address: 64.68.237.67)
Bill Rogers...Oxymorons..I guess I'll have to run right out and
get me one of them classic Glocks in order to avoid future editing by the
sharp witted[sp?]...We're mending just fine . Cheers!
Markwell <markwell@hardynet.com>
Fondling custom Colts Iin the Alleghenies on day 53 I think, WV, USA
- Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 00:27:41 (ZULU) (your host address: 63.92.148.95)
Dunno about that accurate Rugers being an oxymoron. I have a .243
that just about out shoots all my rifles. Its a ruger stainless all weather
in the ugly stock. So long as the bullet weight is kept below 90 grains
it shoots likle a champ. Average for me off the bench is 7/8" at 200 yds
for 10 shots. Much better with only 5 shot strings ;-). I know they tend
to be few and far between but svery once in a while you get that 1 in 1000
rifle from ruger and it is a keeper.
Brian <pyronecro@email.com>
Columbia, SC, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 00:46:58 (ZULU) (your
host address: 24.88.116.129)
Help, Im trying to find out a rough trajectory guide for my 223.Ive
started target shooting with a club that shoots from 300 to 1000 m.I dunno
if Iwill have much succes past about 600 although theres one bloke using
a 223 with a great deal of succes back to 1000 so Ive heard.Im using a
savage 112fv, 62gr projectiles, ar2206 powder wich is vargets little brother.Velocity
is 3000fps.I realise my outfit will be different to everyone else but some
info to get me on the paper would be great, to 800 just in case.Ihad a
look at most of the powder and bullet makers sites without much joy. Norma
has aneat program but doesnt list 223 and for the smaller calibres only
goes to 300.
out
Gavan W <gwillis@simplex.net>
the occupied, socialist state, of Oz - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at
00:52:22 (ZULU) (your host address: 203.87.27.133)
Ken, Lito is right on with the Stealth.. Both of the .308's are
shooters and the 22-250 great. 22-250 works great for Michigan chucks and
Coyotes. Sold one of the .308's to JC to get an FN. Apparently FN is making
the barrels for Winchester and I can't knock the results, solid .75 to
.5MOA results for under $700.
Titan <haterly1@home.com>
MIchigan, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 01:04:01 (ZULU) (your
host address: 24.4.252.150)
"If you want to win, you will carry a government model. To say anything
else is to flaunt your ignorance."
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 01:12:04 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
Mark, that's "gleaned".........Stick to shooting, scrap the Anglish
lessuns......
Mark A. Smith <Windinmane@aol.com>
Lake Cormorant, MS, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 01:34:39 (ZULU)
(your host address: 205.188.199.157)
"About a year ago I bought a NIB Colt match target lightweight 16
inch barrel AR. Since I have had hours and hours of fun with it. Too the
tune of about 2500 rounds. At what point should I start to worry about
replacing the barrel."
Eric
Boca Raton, FL, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 02:05:02 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.12.105.48)
To Colin- Reference M16A2 Zero Targets
Sir,
The NSN for the M16A2 Zero Targets is 6920-01-253-4005
In case you ever need the NSN for the M16A1 that number is:
6920-01-167-1392...Hope this helps you out.
Bobby Whittington <whittington@snipernet.net>
Grandfield, Ok., USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 02:12:01 (ZULU)
(your host address: 63.71.45.36)
PSS=POS? Man, all this time I thought it was the semiauto guys who
were shooting the "POS-9000s", seems Remington got a bit jealous perhaps?
They finally found a way to put some inconsistency into those solid as
a rock bolt actions! And here I am paying extra to play the semi-auto game.
Oh well(shrugs shoulders).
B. Douglas <uglygun@lightspeed.net>
Cowpie, Ca, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 02:15:17 (ZULU) (your
host address: 24.161.204.203)
Hey Feller's,
What can you tell me about the 25-06? Is it accurate to 400yds,
600 yds, will it go to 1,000yds with accuracy?
Matt <Matt_l16630@yahoo.com>
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 02:46:10 (ZULU) (your host address:
63.252.45.7)
Doc Good question and I bet I upset some with the answer. First
you are right that part depends on the size of the target, but another
part is the trajectory of the bullet. The flatter the better (perk up you
mag. lovers!). For this exercise I used 175 grain at 2700 since a bunch
have gone to this round. The 168 will result in worse figures for the longer-range
stuff. This is based on you aiming at the center of the target and a drop
of more than 4.5 inches for a 9-inch target result in a miss low. All of
these computations are for a miss low as a miss high is a bad mil reading
and shooter error while a miss low will be the result of being outside
the ballistic capability of the round. As in the target read is too great
to sustain a hit probability. So now then for the 9 inch target the change
from .8 mils to .7 mils (312.8 357.4) results in a jump that is out of
the ballistic capability of the round resulting in a probable hit low.
The 18 inch target will only allow a drop of 9 inches thus the change form
1.1 to 1.0 mils (454.9 500.4) will result is a sure miss and a change
from 1.2 to 1.1 mils (417 454.9) will be very iffy but doable based on
a .7 inch fudge factor. The 36 inch target will allow for an 18 inch drop
and that change occurs at 1.4 to 1.3(714.9 769.8) results in a miss.
The 72 inch target allows for a drop of 36 inches and this occurs at 2.1
to 2.0( 953.1 1000.8) again results in a possible miss. Does this mean
that a miss will occur everytime, no. Also this is based on a .1 mil incremental
change in ranging. Practice can get you into the .05 ballpark on a regular
basis and this edges these figures up significantly. Hope this answered
your question and if you want more clarification let me know. I am posting
this on the DR for any others that wish the info.
Fayetteville, NC, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 02:59:32 (ZULU)
(your host address: 152.163.204.28)
Jim,
If Master Rick shows up with his promised crew, you will get a lesson
in ABJECT HUMILITY - trust me on this.
Team up a couple of these true Masters as observers for a stalking
event and they turn into Berserkers. Tin helmets with horns, battle axes,
the whole nine yards.ITS SCARY!!! :-0
"Pete That field looked ok to me the last time I studied it.
:-)"
BIG CITY, BY-GAWD, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 03:03:23 (ZULU)
(your host address: 205.188.193.49)
Why are there no Winchester sniper rifles? I know Gunny Hathcock
era sinpers used M70's for a while but why the switch to Remington. The
Winchester Action is defintly a better action.
David <davkenrem@earthlink.net>
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 03:17:34 (ZULU) (your host address:
158.252.12.15)
Gent's.........
Terry <tls8323@cs.com>
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 03:26:39 (ZULU) (your host address:
205.188.196.47)
Rosterferians, does anyone remember what unit "Slugboy" is with?
There is a good article in the April SOF Magazine about 42 Commando and
some poop on the Sierra Leone mission.
Bolt <reeldoctor@mindspring.com>
NC, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 03:38:29 (ZULU) (your host
address: 63.50.54.105)
MikeMiller2, there are 7 steel businesses listed in the Yuma yellow
pages. What you want is "E" types or "F" ("Dog") types made out of Brinell
500 or T-1 3/8 inch steel sheet. They can also fabricate frames out of
angle-iron, and you can take them to that wonderful Adair County Ranges
park and shoot out to 1,000 yards!
Yuma, AZ, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 03:59:18 (ZULU) (your
host address: 198.26.122.13)
Greetings gentlemen.
Bob Tulley <rtulley@home.com>
So County, CA, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 04:49:54 (ZULU)
(your host address: 24.4.254.50)
Where is Bravo?
Michael <mike1000@pacbell.net>
SJ, CA, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 05:35:25 (ZULU) (your host
address: 63.192.208.6)
Rich S.
Have had this colt for over 15yrs but havent used it much. To bizy
trying to perfect longer and longer ranges.
I hate the thought of parting with any of my collection, it feels
like I am selling one of my kids. But I don't like having things I don't
use. I have sold quite a few of the "kids" and i miss them all, but even
kids grow up and go away. Anyway if you need one more than myself maybe
we could come to an agreement.
Jim <azgeneral1@aol.com>
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 06:30:42 (ZULU) (your host address:
205.188.195.192)
I have been following the Remington thread. I have had nothing but
good dealings with them, albeit with the custom shop. Mine is a 40x built
into an M24 clone. Good shooter.
Gizmo <ssn581@teleport.com>
Beavercreek , OR, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 07:41:53 (ZULU)
(your host address: 216.26.62.71)
KC- I have both the LTR and the PSS. I just got the LTR a few months
ago and am still "playing" with it. It's set up with a M3LR and MK 4 mounts/rings.
Over all I think you should give it serious consideration. I have shot
for group to 600 with mine and so far it has stayed sub MOA. I may have
got a unexpected jewel due to all the complaints of late about Remmy's,
but I like mine. The PSS has pretty much stayed in the case since I've
had the LTR. As far as the PSS goes I'm very happy with it too, it's a
very good out of the box shooter. I think you should try them both and
see what rifle trips your switch. For general police (urban)use I would
pick my LTR. It shoots good and is much easier to carry in the car, taking
up a lot less room. The shorter barrel and overall lighter rifle have me
sold when I'm doing anything that envolves movement or stalks. It's just
a handier rifle.
joe <spojoehpd@aol.com>
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 09:39:50 (ZULU) (your host address:
207.215.153.173)
BT..
Pat <mrbullet@hotmail.com>
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 14:51:38 (ZULU) (your host address:
207.41.18.130)
PeteR wrote: "If Master Rick shows up with his promised crew, you
will get a lesson in ABJECT HUMILITY - trust me on this."
NJ, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 15:38:41 (ZULU) (your host
address: 12.20.190.1)
Lady and Gents,
Wes Howe <wsaa@proaxis.com>
Blodgett, OR, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 16:01:32 (ZULU) (your
host address: 192.6.15.20)
Regarding product problems in general:
Remington's are POS!
TASCO's are POS, use Leupold!
Leupold's have defects in optics!
HS Precision stocks have built in defects (based on complaint about
Remington problems)!
Ruger's have bad triggers!
Winchester's are difficult to bed!
AR's are banned from California (had to throw this one in for obvious
reasons)
CA, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 16:45:16 (ZULU) (your host
address: 24.41.43.38)
Byron: Yep. I have a newish Remington 700 that works just fine.
Except for the trigger adjustment and the B-Square screws torqued to 65
lbs, it's right out of the box. Factory ammo shoots pretty damned good.
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 17:14:17 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
Bill Rogers:
Regarding your list "...for the use of oxymorons!" and "Cheap Hummers..."
Evidently, sir, you were never with MY friends on R&R in Bangkok!
I will admit, one does tend to pay for the cheaper ones for weeks
to come.... Quad-HA! ;-) Another use for Hope's #9 on a patch!
I'm sorry for the BAD pun ... couldn't resist ;-)))
Semper Fi,
Griff
Griff <G_Griffin @AFI.com>
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 17:25:08 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.244.73.153)
Byron...
I think you missed something here on the Remington thing.
The repair department is less 20% of what it was befor the Stren
take over... most of the skilled gun makers have been replaced by younger
guys with no gun experence... Remington does NOT do most of the repairs
that are sent to them... they farm out the repairs to small shops, because
they have cut their own repair department.
The reason is, they have replaced skilled gun makers, and skilled
inspectors, with new, cheap labor... and these people don't know that it's
a problem if the feeding is rough (it DID go into the chamber!)... and
what's the difference if the barrel is off to one side of the channel..
it STILL SHOOTS!!.
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 17:25:30 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.62)
Rick-A belated thank you for taking the time to answer my e-mail
about the post reticle of known moa dimensions.
Bartlesville, OK, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 17:31:32 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.12.104.151)
Gentlemen:
I have an M1A with an ARMS#18 Mount, which I am planning on scoping
with a TASCO SS10X42M. I am looking for good QD Rings and thought I would
ask your collective wisdom on which way to go. i.e. Brand as well as High,
Medium, or Low height rings. I want to keep the profile as low as possible
Respectfully
Hans
Hans <lrayner@southwind.net>
Buhler, Kansas, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 17:35:48 (ZULU)
(your host address: 206.252.188.168)
Byron & CDC - The Issues being addressed by Lito, Myself, and
others is not one of pissing on Big Green, it is one of servicing a customer
after money has been sent on the product. I am in the Service/Mfging business
and I preach constantly to my people about quality and the Customer comes
first. Without the customer I cease to exist as a business. This is not
to say that mistakes( Honest ones) are not made, I know they are. But I
sure don't ignore my customer and tell then to piss up a rope. I feel it
my duty to correct whatever problem there was with the product to very
best of my ability. Sometimes I even give more than I should, but when
that customer refers you to another, it pays off in the long run. Even
when the customer is wrong, there are professional ways to resolve the
problems that arise. Ultimately if the problem is not solved, word gets
out that a company does piss poor work and people go else where. This is
the case with Remington as I see it. Remington is not honoring the warranty,
and it is pissing people off. Is everything they ship junk, heck no. But
the few that are bad, are not being corrected.
If they are, How about 5R barrels like the old days? Please.......
Titan <hatherly1@home.com>
Michigan, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 18:37:51 (ZULU) (your
host address: 24.4.252.150)
Pablito: Looking over the roster, the problems with Remingtons that
you discuss would not have been produced by an adequate process. A company
like Mazda, or - I would imagine - SKB, would have completely redesigned
the process if it produced a small fraction of the defects produced by
Remington's process.
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 18:43:52 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
I want to load up some 175 gr for my 308. I'm going to use Fed primers
and Fed brass. I got a lot of IMR4064 what is a good starting point?
LeMay <M40A1SNIPER@att.net>
MI, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 18:49:29 (ZULU) (your host
address: 204.24.102.133)
Titan: I agree. A satisfied customer tells a couple of close friends.
A delighted customer tells twice as many people. With an unsatisfied customer,
its a little more than that. If the customer truly believes he got screwed,
he tells everybody that will listen. It spreads like wildfire. Customer
service is the key.
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 18:54:29 (ZULU) (your host address:
134.50.253.11)
CDC...
Yup... this time it was you, and a lot of guys are "lucky".
There are good ones out there... probably most of them, but the
number of problem 700s and PSS's is too high to be acceptable, and talking
about them out loud here, will give guys a heads up, when they go to the
gun shop.
Read this stuff, and when you go to plunk your money down, you will
look at the crown, look at the stock channel space, and see if it's the
same... try the trigger, maybe try the action with a "dummy" round, check
other "basic" things before signing the yellow sheet.
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 19:01:58 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.132)
Ok.. so Remington has their problems...
Carpe Diem and all that..
DakotaAviator <DakotaAviator@hotmail.com>
Grand Forks, ND, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 19:46:06 (ZULU)
(your host address: 134.129.136.166)
Doc More info on your max mil question. There is another thing
to remember on the max mil and that is when the strike of the bullet will
still hit the top of a target if that target is miled too far away. As
an example, the target is a 36 inch target and you mil him at 1.3 mils
or 834 yards, then you will miss over the head if the target is really
1.4 mils. Now then the 72-inch target is disceptive as the target aim point
is really the same for the 36-inch target. Thus you have 54 inches of drop
before you run out of target. That puts you at 1.9 or 1053 still hitting
a target at 1.8 or 1112 while the over the top shot is still figured at
18 inches.
Fayetteville, NC, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 20:58:47 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.12.104.33)
DakotaAviator wrote,
"How about some of you guys with more experience in this area list
the top 10 or 15 things you would ALWAYS check if you were looking at a
gun in a shop and going to buy it? (Sniper type rigs...)"
Go to a large retail outlet (Walmart or Dicks) and buy the least
expensive Remington M700 you can find with the right bolt face. Or pick
up a used rifle at at the right price.
Throw away the stock and the barrel.
Take what's left to a good riflesmith and have him build you a rifle.
Remember these names: McMillan, Hart, Badger, Leupold, Federal
Clifton Springs, New York, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 21:02:59
(ZULU) (your host address: 64.80.33.70)
Bravo:
Thanks for the advice, I take it AR weopons are barreled in hard
metals and are made rugged for all purpose combat use, as opposed to finer
match barrels on bolt guns. Also the .223 or 5.56 doesn't wear as hard
on any thing as a mag bullet with lots of powder.
Big Will <Madlogger@hotmail.com>
cabarrus county, NC, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 21:52:52 (ZULU)
(your host address: 166.82.1.83)
Mildot experience and thoughts this week!
NC, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 22:28:27 (ZULU) (your host
address: 63.50.54.192)
Moe, thanks for the heads up. FYI REMINGTON - I called their TOP
LE rep today, he says if you can believe this, that 2 moa is acceptable
for the PUBLIC and 1 moa is acceptable for POLICE. NOW HEAD UP - He told
me that THERE ARE 700PSS'S NOW FLOATING AROUND THAT HAD THE WRONG FIRING
PINS PUT INTO THEM BUT THEY DON;T KNOW WHICH GUNS IE: SERIAL NUMBERS! HE
ALSO TOLD ME THAT SOME OF THE LTR'S GOT THE INSODE OFTHE BARRELLS COATED
WITH EXTERIOR COATINGS BECOUSE THE PLUGS WERE NOT PLACED RIGHT WHEN THEY
WERE TREATED. He still maintains that Remington produces fine products
and provided me with the name / number of the FBI in Va to talk to about
their weapons. I was also told that if I had ANY problems to BE SURE AND
TALK TO A LE REP AT REMINGTON and tell them it was an LE gun. There are
NO LE customer service reps, just the plain jane customer service reps
and that "They don;t know how the law enforcement end works". So as far
as I am concerned I am back to square one. Remington admits they have problems
and admits that warrantyt work IS NOT done in house unless you specifically
request it ie: LAW ENFORCEMENT. I an not an armor so how the hell am suppost
to know if I get one of the guns with the wrong firing pin. After all he
did say that "Almost everyone will never know they have a gun wit the wrong
pin unless they have a problem with the weapon. I DON;T WANT THE HAVE TO
WAIT AND FIND OUT I HAVE THE WRONG FIRING PIN WHEN I NEED THE WEAPON TO
WORK! I guess this dumb old cop will have to go to armor school or something.
It's a shame quality has gone down the toilet !
KC <swatcop911@msn.com>
Dallas, Tx, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 22:48:14 (ZULU) (your
host address: 63.62.168.111)
DakotaAviator...
>>"Ok.. so Remington has their problems...
Carpe Diem and all that..."<<
"...that 2 moa is acceptable for the PUBLIC".
... and PSS's at $750 + a pop?
... And nobody can figure why stealths are so "in demand".
USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 23:03:34 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.16)
Uuummm, have you folks been following the David and Sallie posts
on the Emporium? Let's take a look here!
NC, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 23:07:50 (ZULU) (your host
address: 63.50.54.192)
Hey guys,
What are these? Obviously it's a rifle, but what is it and who makes
these? would you consider them to be a better rifle than the Remingtons?
It seems like alot of people are ripping on Remington. Which seems odd
to me cosidering the following Remington seems to have.
Eric
Thanks to roger for the info on Ammoman.com
Eric <Alpine@coslink.com>
Mich, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 23:40:59 (ZULU) (your host
address: 64.68.237.33)
Ok had to come back to much knowledge here to pass up.
Anyhow got a problem with a friends gun I cant seem to figure out.
The gun is a used custom rifle,,douglas barrel, on a mauser action,,7mm
remington mag scoped with a nikon. all on a mcmillan stock. Problem,,varrying
accuracy. one day the rifle will shoot like it should,,the next bullets
flying everywhere. Now we have tried every kind of ammunition available
in the area, and the only thing it seems to shoot good is winchester Xs
in 150 grn. everything esle looks like scud missiles trying to hit the
target.
He is in the process of buying a reloader to do some homeloads now
but I cant imagine a custom rifle like that not being able to shoot most
factory at least satisfactory.
So without taking it to a gunsmith,,any suggestions? Possibly throat
to worn and if so how do I check?
Partison
Kalispell, Mt., USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 23:45:27 (ZULU)
(your host address: 206.252.229.237)
Whazzup guys?
Deno <rrrdean@mindspring.com>
Fort Worth, TX, USA - Tuesday, February 27, 2001 at 23:50:16 (ZULU)
(your host address: 199.174.55.14)
Quality Control Issues:
A little blast of someone other the Big Green.
Nov 2000 Vancouver City Police ERT ran an Andvanced Sniper Course,
during the course one constable fell out of a tree and snapped the McMillan
stock on his PSS. An inspection of the stock found a large air bubble (were
it broke). Mc had several (some times heated)discussions denying that one
of theirs could ever break. Then saying that it must have been run over
by a vehicle. When the stock was shipped to Mc - it apparently never made
it. Mind you you might think that it should have been shipped signature
required.
Kevin of the GWN <bolandks@home.com>
Canada - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 00:18:25 (ZULU) (your host
address: 24.71.223.143)
I have a question regarding my Leupold Long Range M3. I zeroed it
today at 100 meters. I tried to slip the scale to 100 meters but was unable.
Because of the stop on the turret it seems like it must be zeroed at 300
meters. I guess that's OK because there's only a couple inches difference
in drop between 100 and 300 meters, but wonder why it is calibrated on
the scale below 300 meters? I checked my literature that came with the
scope but found nothing helpful. Thanks for any info.
John
John <jkubrock@hotmail.com>
AZ, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 00:36:57 (ZULU) (your host
address: 162.42.111.118)
Glad all the gripin finally reached a man with the right size boot
and the rocks big enough to greaz it and kick it up Remingtons ass. WE
ALL APRECIATE IT and are glad of the bad response it only proves our gripes
to be true.
2 moa LOL
Cabarrus, NC, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 00:38:20 (ZULU)
(your host address: 166.82.1.83)
Reeldoctor,
No my dear boy, 1st Bn. The Parachute Regiment (doesn't take us
as long to get into theatre) Healthy rivals but duelly respected
Slugboy <Slug.boy@virgin.net>
England - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 00:42:07 (ZULU) (your host
address: 62.253.64.4)
John...
your cam (BDC) is defective... sent it back, with a letter discribing
the problem, and tell them you want a new one. The proper cam WILL drop
right on at 100.
Marlins may come in a red box, but they have no connection with
the company that has "THE" Big red box ;))
Go here
http://www.fnmfg.com/lawenf/rifle/riflemain.htm
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 00:53:18 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.16)
Big Will -
"Thanks for the advice, I take it AR weopons are barreled in hard
metals and are made rugged for all purpose combat use, as opposed to finer
match barrels on bolt guns. Also the .223 or 5.56 doesn't wear as hard
on any thing as a mag bullet with lots of powder."
I'm going to pop for the Harris 6-9" and really learn how to eat
dirt!
Moe Mensale <mjmensale@aol.com>
Boca Raton, FL, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 00:58:32 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.12.105.49)
'Lito - I talked with an engineer at FN last week when I ordered
my rifle and he gave me some insight into the barrel on the FN and the
Stealth. Apparently, FN is making the barrels for all of these rifles using
the same process they use in making machine gun barrels. He discribed it
as a pressed barrel using a 250 ton press. I never heard of the process,
but maybe you or some others might be able to shed some light here. Fn
claims that no cutting is involved in the blank production, and that after
cryo treating the blanks they are chambered and fitted. From what I have
personally seen with my Stealth's something is being done right. The FN
rifle has a chrome plated bore and chamber, but FN told me they will garentee
1MOA. The engineer I spoke with indicated the FN's will shoot as well if
not better than the Winchester's. I should have mine in a couple of weeks,
and will be happy to let everyone know how it turns out. These things are
supposed to have the HS mag system, HS stocks, and Stainless Steel guts.
I was also told that FN will have as many as six models on the market with
in a year different options. It looks like they want the old PSS business
if it turns out as advertised.
Titan <hatherly1@home.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 01:56:45 (ZULU) (your host address:
24.4.252.150)
Titan...
That makes sense, since H-S makes the Winchester target/Stealh stocks,
and H-S has, what appears to be, the only detachable magazine system around
that works right.
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 02:04:59 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.16)
'lito - AICS 5&10rd Det mags
Yes I know, count clicks anyway.
Canada - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 02:50:35 (ZULU) (your host
address: 24.71.223.143)
Lito...
>>>?"Ok.. so Remington has their problems...
>>>Carpe Diem and all that..."
>>>Sorry you're so bored with this thread... but then why would
you >>>want a list of 10 or 15 more boring things that can be wrong?"
-From all the post here we are all aware that Remington has problems.
By now this is a fact known to anyone who spends more than 10 minutes reading
this roster.
-Buyer beware (like I had to explain that to you guys)...
Well I (and I am sure others as well) want to know WHAT to beware
of with Remingtons rifles.
Grand Forks ND, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 03:07:39 (ZULU)
(your host address: 134.129.187.15)
I need some help!
a person would make if they wore black bdu's in a wooded setting
vs a person wearing camo bdu's? Or the differances in tiger stripes
and camo bdu's?
before I can convince him in a field setting, I would like to take
show him some photos, then take him to the woods.
would like to add some more.
Pakrat <psfamily@mail.com>
Hempstead, TX, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 03:10:44 (ZULU)
(your host address: 207.218.245.6)
Oops...
DakotaAviator <DakotaAviator@hotmail.com>
Grand Forks ND, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 03:19:28 (ZULU)
(your host address: 134.129.187.15)
DakotaAviator...
>"Carpe Diem and all that..."
>-Buyer beware (like I had to explain that to you guys)..."
"Got a M118 BDC for my M3 - Suprisingly it tracks the Fed GM2 extraordinarily
well out to 900m."
Pablito <condor@mags.net>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 03:21:13 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.249.180.103)
just received my savage 10 FP and i'm in the process of mounting
the simmons 44 mag scope. I need experienced suggestions on the best mounts
and rings to purchase. I plan to use the rifle for field use and some noncompetitive
benchrest shooting at ranges from 200 to 350 yards. This rifle is chambered
in .223. Thanks in advance
mike edgcomb <tmmces@fidnet.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 03:42:09 (ZULU) (your host address:
216.229.73.66)
'lito - 'Well of course dude' Sarcasm I assume? -everyone has given
me horror stories of the M118 BDC.
Anyone else have problems on Adult Signature Required packages -
as in just left on the porch?
Canada - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 03:50:44 (ZULU) (your host
address: 24.71.223.143)
RE: Anyone else have problems on Adult Signature Required packages
- as in just left on the porch?
Roger C. <madeditor75@hotmail.com>
Austin, Tx, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 03:58:59 (ZULU) (your
host address: 24.28.72.177)
Moe:
SOOOO sorry to be so general and let you shoot me down like that.
Didn't mean to cunfuse anyone by saying 223/5.56 just a habit. I seem to
have the foolish idea that .223s don't eat barrels out like Magnums do
they have a BIG difference in case capacity. For example 300winmag : it
takes 61 gr. of imr4895 to push a 180gr SMK only 2822fps
223: takes only 24.5gr. of the same powder to push a 69 gr. SMK
2710fps
Are we speaking of Winchester as far as THE RED BOX cause as far
as I know Winchester is related to Marlin. If we are not Speaking of Winchester
though please let me know.
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 04:56:56 (ZULU) (your host address:
166.82.1.83)
On Remington PSS'?..my 26" PSS bought in 1994 was a POS. Would not
group under 3/4" ever. Normally, I would have been happy but my friend's
24" PSS bought in 1991 was a one holer from day one so I knew things could
be better. Chandler re-crowned it, cleared the camming surfaces and made
it a little better. Rather than throw it in the dumpster, I gave it to
John Eckenrode. John set the barrel back 0.700" and rechambered it to get
the proper throat for 168 Sierras. John found it to be 0.009" out of concentricity.
Bored out guard bolt holes. Shoots in high .2's now. Barrel still fouls
like a bitch. $170 to Chandler. John Eckenrode got $175 so $345 pissed
away so far to fix a brand new $780 rifle. A new Hart barrel costs $320.
Hummmm?.. doesn't take long to figure it out! It is currently being rebarreled
to .223.
problem number 2: throat way too long
Problem number 3: chamber not concentric with bore
Problem number 4: Rough barrel
Problem number 5: guard bolts impacting bedding block
Problem number 6: fore-end slapping barrel on firing
Clearwater, FL, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 05:13:39 (ZULU)
(your host address: 24.28.56.240)
Folks,
Use a 1:8" twist and 140/142 grainers and you're home free.
(The Reverend)
Wes Howe <wsaa@proaxis.com>
Blodgett, OR, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 05:20:08 (ZULU)
(your host address: 198.145.248.72)
DakotaAviator:
Hank <ninesoft2@earthlink.net>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 05:38:40 (ZULU) (your host address:
65.7.134.51)
KC,
CA, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 06:47:28 (ZULU) (your host
address: 24.41.43.38)
I lost 140lbs. 3 years ago and was glad to see her walk out the
door.To selabrate I went out and bought a new rifel,a Remington 700 ADL
at wallyworld. 270WIN all the problems that have ben discused hear it had.However
the chamber is in line with the bore.I had to straten the barell and do
a lot of hand laping the bore was just to tight.re cround it shot it and
laped some more.After about 12 or maby a little more hrs.It shoots darn
good .Yes I did glass bed and free float also 1/2" AT 100 YDS.
Bud <offah@hotmail.com>
Greens Fork , In. , USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 08:37:36
(ZULU) (your host address: 63.106.153.61)
Ref: Sniper Falls from Tree
Yikes!!! Haven't seen that since watching "Sands of Iwo Jima".
If the stock on a PSS broke it's H&S you should call not McMillan.
I've had Remington barrels that shot well but would foul so badly
that I rebarreled just to save money on patches and bore cleaner. My Hart
barrels clean up quickly and don't sweat green for days like factory. It
may be related to the mirror finish in the bore.
If you want GOOD: Buy a PSS and shut up.
If you want BETTER: Get a PSS tune up.
If yo want BEST: Have a rifle built and pony up.
Kevin R. Mussack (Andy's Dad) <kmussack@aol.com>
Clifton Springs, New York, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 12:53:01
(ZULU) (your host address: 64.80.33.70)
700P? Mine shoots in the mid .3's with handloads and a trigger job.
Out of the box, the barrel was off center, the stock had to be inletted
and the trigger was set to gorilla. The throat is long..... 2.910 OAL to
the lands. More than 1/10 of an inch out?????You've got to be kidding me.
How much of a liabilty buffer does Remington need anyway? Fed 168 GM shoots
.5 -.6 and handloads shoot in the mid .3's. BTW, my handloads are .030
off and don't fit in the mag.......
breakpoint <breakpointx@yahoo.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 14:10:06 (ZULU) (your host address:
12.3.204.222)
All this talk of Remmy's slide from grace is depressing. The 700
I picked up about this time last year doesn't have the problems that people
are talking about. I must have been one of the lucky ones. The throat does
seem long to me, though. I was trying to seat my handloads off the rifling,
and when I tried the "bullet in the empty case" trick to get the chamber
OAL, it looked like hardly any of the bullet was still in the case. Maybe
I'm pulling the bullet out farther when I eject it, or screwing it up somehow.
But if I remember right, the OAL of the test rounds came out to be just
a hair below 3.00" and I could never get the same measurement twice. Is
that normal? It gives me a queasy feeling to thing my baby might be defective.
Maybe I should just breakdown and get a gauge.
Larry <ljw@niroinc.com>
Freaking-Cold, WI, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 14:46:43 (ZULU)
(your host address: 63.114.100.234)
Bolt; if your within 20 to 40 yards that's pretty good. I am currently
trying a Sheperd. Much faster than Mil dots. So far just as accurate or
moreso. IT behoves me to see why someone doesn't make this... standby...
the patent for Sheperd was issued in 1981. I've heard patents after 20
years are up. Don't know if it applies to this or not???? Question anyone
who knows? I've noticed the one shot zero is now in some Weaver scopes.
I've heard bad on Sheperd optics but I'm wondering.. was trying to resolve
some bullet holes the other day with a 12X Cabela's 30mm scope (windriver
type) and a 4.5X14 Leupold Tactical. Guess what?
I had to get the 10X Sheperd to see em. That floored me! Also IF
that scope moves zero 1/8 inch you can see it immediately thus insuring
the scope stays put. Your impact can change but you will know if it's the
scope. That game your playing would bore you to death with a Sheperd and
would take about a minute to shoot all ten targets. Wind interpolation
is probably not much better on a sheperd but you have a circle of known
diameter at the distance your shooting it's pretty easy to interopolate
(kentucky windage). Don't quote me... but I'd hate to face a good man with
a Sheperd and me with nothing but MIl dots. While I was admiring my Leupold
crispness and quality and working out my mathematical solutions I would
expect to have my butt shot off....Those circles you shoot through and
imagine aren't precise as cross hairs will amaze you. Now lets' hear from
someone the Sheperd has failed? Leupold, take a look at that Patent!
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 15:11:42 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
Dallas Sniper; Get you some .308/.223 VSS or .308/.223 VSSF Remingtons
and have the barrels lopped off and BOSS systems installed. A good smith
will give you 36 to 48 oz triggers with no creep. You won't have to do
anything else to shoot .5 moa. Besides those stainless guns will require
low maintence and fit nicely in a squad car with 20" barrels. You can put
the blank BOSS on there to avoid muzzle blast to the sides if you need
too and still fine tune the accuracy (which probably won't need it) . The
impact won't change any perceptable amount. The perps won't know the difference
or care. You can get your armorers to do it tools from Brownell. Put a
good scope on em and your ready to go. You might even take a look at the
Sheperd's. If your troops are only mildly trained the Shep is easy to learn.
The M3LR is also fast but does require mil dot calculations.
The stainless models have fewer problems in my humble experience.
I've never had a bad stainless... which I could say that about PSS
and other police models. Oh I could say something... I've never had one
that didn't require something to make it right.
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 15:23:48 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
Kevin (Andy's Dad) - All of Vancouver ERT's PSS's have been aftermarket
equipt with Mc A3 stocks. I have no bones against Mc - a buddy of mine
(another Kevin)fell almost 40ft out of a tree with a C3A1 and trashed himself
(yes he failed the stalk) but not the stock (Mc A3) nor the 10x Unertl
(though he should have).
Kevin of the GWN <bolandks@home.com>
Canada - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 15:30:35 (ZULU) (your host
address: 24.71.223.143)
Snub magnums:
The Rockies where it's 24 below today, USA - Wednesday, February 28,
2001 at 15:35:53 (ZULU) (your host address: 12.32.34.12)
L42A1
Frances <francis.fitzpatrick@bakernet.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 15:57:37 (ZULU) (your host address:
208.193.53.242)
Bolt..
I usually will have a, "is it 1.2 or is it 1.3 mils" so I figure
both and split the difference and I usually come pretty damn close doing
it that way.
I have to agree on the Shepard they are damn fast if shooting at
a known size 18" or 9" target. The only thing I found was that past 600
the circles get pretty damn small and are real close to the same size say
a 700 and a 800 yard circle not a lot of difference. Whats your thoughts
on that??
Pat <mrbullet@hotmail.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 17:36:56 (ZULU) (your host address:
207.41.18.130)
Pat; yes they are small at that range. Of course you must range
with small objects out there. For instance you can't decide to range the
car instead of the mailbox like you can with mil dots. Unless you do some
math of course. You can use the 300 yard circle at 900 but the size is
different if you see what I'm saying. (eg 48"=300 circle at 900).The size
of the circles is some issue but I found I could often shoot better through
the circles since nothing covered the target.
I was surprised to see my 700 yard groups less than 1 moa when they
had not been. I'm still workin on this one. No real opinion yet.
If you're on a tactical course that gives you lot's of time and
everyone is doing Mil dot math. It would be doubfull if the Sheperd would
be more accurate if as accurate but if time is the issue... it really makes
a difference and it's pretty much idiot proof.
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 18:04:32 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
Kevin, who has given you these horror stories? We use the M118 all
the time it tracks very nicely. Of course we use M118 with it. :-)
Fayetteville, NC, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 18:25:18 (ZULU)
(your host address: 152.163.207.57)
The topic of the military designated marksman rifle hasn't come
up of late. Does anyone have any new dope on the subject?
Jim Mitchell <medicjim86@hotmail.com>
NJ, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 18:59:53 (ZULU) (your host
address: 12.20.190.1)
I wish the Remingtons were good-to-go from factory. And I wish they
had steel trigger guard to begin with. Still when somebody said that a
box-stock 700 USD rifle shooting 3/4 MOA is POS I tend to disagree with
that statement.
Hexa <juhola@luukku.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 19:07:56 (ZULU) (your host address:
64.58.22.7)
Jim Mitchell...... I think that the 20" H-Bar flattop with ACOG
sight is going in the right direction for the DMR role. After reading the
article in TS by the Chandler Bros. that trashed the M14 DMR concept and
advanced the flattop M/ACOG idea, I got myself a 20" H-Bar Colt and put
the ACOG/NSN scope on it. Granted, this ACOG reticule is calibrated for
the M4 and the SS109, I have had decent results out to the 600yd. max of
this ACOG using SS109 (S&B) with the 20" bbl. When I say decent at
that distance I mean "minute of chest area", and given the not-so-great
accuracy of the SS109 IMHO that is good enough for what it is! One of the
tasks that I've set for myself this spring is to try and develop a 69gr.SMK
load that will fly with my ACOG reticle.I recently installed the EXBAL
program in my computer, and my wife just presented me with an Oehler 35
for my birthday, so load development should be a little easier:-)
PS- this was not a slam on the M14/type rifle - I own and love two
of them!
ALAN <asimon@gj.net>
PALISADE, COLORADO, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 20:18:10
(ZULU) (your host address: 216.169.65.222)
Rick..
I had one on a 300WM and I shot the 190s with it at the exact FPS
the scope called for and as far as the accuracy of the reticle it was right
on the money. I put 16 out of 18 rounds into a 4.5" circle shooting from
100 to 700yds on a known distance course.
Pat <mrbullet@hotmail.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 20:48:59 (ZULU) (your host address:
207.41.18.130)
Rick; I won't scrap with you on that one either. I've seen the shift
but at least you know there's been a change. But when that zero is set
the parallax can be seen immediately and it keeps you dead center eyed
in the scope. It's not known which cross hair has shifted but it lets you
know something has happened. OF course we'd like to thing nothing moves...It's
gonna be a while whether or not I would take on the mil x with those circles
but I've so far been able to shoot up to par on real small paper targets
and iron maidens. Now if you were trying to range a "head" it would be
a difficult call but how would that be with Mil dots too? We did the ice
box contest with a Sheperd and a Mil scope 4.5X14X40 Leupy that I thought
was pretty fine. The rifles were identical Remington 700's. Then we changed
rifles and did it again. Both shooters were so close to identical you couldn't
call it even in the wind. The only thing that changed was the time. But....that's
just 2 shooters on 1 day and although it's pretty close with the 2 it's
still just a small sample and shooting experience would enter possibly
also. I don't know how it would work for different shooters with different
backgrounds. We did notice in high winds the Sheperd gets harder to wind
because sometimes it's off to the side quite a bit at 800 or so. Too tell
the truth the application of dog hunting requires more speed than a mil
dot delivers cause those old boys ain't waiting around a lot of the time.
They have noses and know how to use em....and we can afford a miss. Only
thing would worry me is that I know the Shep is gonna shoot first if he
see's me at the same time. And he might not miss.
He's gonna be damned close if he can see at all. I'm glad to hear
you guys have tried it with your aps in mind.
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 21:09:08 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
Rick; I just reread your post (ten for ten optimism) and figured
out it might be a reference to the game thing I was talking to Bolt about.
I think it came accross that I thought the Shep would hit all ten targets.
Naddda!
There would be ranging mistakes and windage mistakes there too.
But it just wouldn't take as long to make em.:-)
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 21:18:46 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
Frances; just to get to your question. You can use the Mil dots
on full power but they take on different values on most scope when you
reduce the power. This is usually where you want them anyway because the
job of interpolation is best at higher powers. The same is true of the
Sheperd Scopes for those interested. They are used at 10X/which is their
maximum.
Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 21:24:11 (ZULU) (your host address:
209.184.248.252)
www.enemyatthegatesmovie.com
This is comming out in March. Set in Stalingrad December 1942.
couple of main characters named Maj Koning and SGT Zaitsev, maybe
some of us heard of them.:)
Jon <M21SWS@aol.com>
Ohio, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 22:16:35 (ZULU) (your host
address: 152.163.204.189)
Cornfusion arising again, as usual!
Bolt <reeldoctor@mindspring.com>
NC, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 22:29:57 (ZULU) (your host
address: 63.49.118.227)
I have been shooting with Shephard scope for a while now and have
found them good to about 700 for first shot hits. The one thing is that
a shephard is always the same relationship for distance to the circles,
it does not matter what magnification you use. The circles are in the front
of the scope and get sized by the change of magnification. Unlike mil dots
the shephard works the same throughout its range. Still, almost impossible
to range accurately beyond 700, but then again, look at the average distance
an encounter happens at and decide if the increase in speed is worth it.
But be ready to accept that it is less accurate at extended ranges.
Brian <pyronecro@email.com>
Columbia, SC, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 22:56:18 (ZULU)
(your host address: 24.88.116.129)
Laddies............
On the Rem LONG leade.........Before you think it's T O O long....check
a Chandler..........how's about .160-3...
Short leades, don't always accuracy make.......
Some booolets don't care for a no jump.....Most, YES...but not ALL........
On the Rem, factory priced, good to go.guaronteed...$1K.......
Forget it......save another $6-$700.00....and get a REAL screamer.
Slap a SS quality barrel, good, not the BEST....and maybe.......
Terry <tls8323@cs.com>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 23:01:18 (ZULU) (your host address:
152.163.201.177)
REM 700PSS PROBLEMS
Are the problems I am reading about with the PSS's in just one caliber.
Are they in 223 or 308 or 300 mag I have one in 308 and it shoots great.
Just bought a 300 mag a few months ago and was wondering because it has
not been out of the box yet. THANKS Doug
Doug <dkb@pcpartner.net>
USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 23:18:07 (ZULU) (your host address:
207.177.19.67)
At the risk of sounding stupid I ask this question.
Eric
Big Will- You poked fun at me for not knowing what the red box was.
Your statement was "What fool doesn't know what kind of rifle comes
in a red box?" Obviously you are that fool as the stealth is a Winchester
made product not a marlin!!!!
Eric <Alpine@coslink.com>
Traverse, Mich, USA - Wednesday, February 28, 2001 at 23:51:58 (ZULU)
(your host address: 64.68.237.151)